this post was submitted on 22 Oct 2024
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Far from being "invincible," the IDF's morale is broken. Snip:

After a year of committing genocide in Gaza, more and more Israeli soldiers are quietly refusing orders to return to the strip to fight, saying they are depressed, worn out, psychologically damaged, and unmotivated, according to a report by Ha-Makom magazine published on 20 October.

The ultra-Orthodox-oriented magazine interviewed multiple soldiers and parents of soldiers who refuse to return to Gaza. When a platoon of 30 soldiers of the Nahal Brigade was recently ordered to enter Gaza for the latest of several tours, only six reported for duty.

“I call it refusal and rebellion,” says Inbal, the mother of one of the soldiers in the platoon.

“They return to the same buildings that they cleaned, each time trapping them anew. They have been to Al-Zaytoun neighborhood three times already. They understand that it is futile and pointless.”

Although they had only a fifth of their personnel, the commander still insisted they enter Gaza.

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[–] footfaults@hexbear.net 103 points 2 weeks ago

did-someone aww did someone commit war crimes that haunt their conscience?

[–] Skeleton_Erisma@hexbear.net 66 points 2 weeks ago

I would simply stop being settlers committing a genocide but ya know.

[–] Diuretic_Materialism@hexbear.net 61 points 2 weeks ago

Yah know you could just spot participating in a genocide, that'd probably do wonders for your mental health shrug-outta-hecks

[–] Robert_Kennedy_Jr@hexbear.net 59 points 2 weeks ago
[–] take_five_seconds@hexbear.net 57 points 2 weeks ago

Shoot and cry

[–] NephewAlphaBravo@hexbear.net 52 points 2 weeks ago

Frag yourself and frag everyone around you

[–] UlyssesT@hexbear.net 48 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)

Does this mean some shoot-and-cry war movie treat in a decade or two, or a P R E S T I G E T V treatment to blur the morality of it all and give a lot of quips to make the atrocity enjoyers seem relatable?

[–] someone@hexbear.net 6 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

I find it hard to get upset during the tank-introduction scene in "All Quiet On The Western Front" because we all know what happened to a hell of a lot of German soldiers who survived WW1.

Death to the Freikorps

[–] SexUnderSocialism@hexbear.net 48 points 2 weeks ago

Boo fucking hoo.

[–] SteamedHamberder@hexbear.net 48 points 2 weeks ago

They’re just gonna call in blackwater next month.

[–] marxisthayaca@hexbear.net 43 points 2 weeks ago (3 children)

Is this cause they are getting their shit rocked, or is it that they are human and are traumatized from following orders? I dunno which would be the better answer. I’m just glad Israel is falling apart

[–] KobaCumTribute@hexbear.net 68 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)

The latter, probably. People fundamentally do not handle horror and atrocity well, no matter how eagerly they dive into it or how loudly they beat their chest and bay for blood. It's something inherently corrosive and destructive that can't just be warded off by being a bloodthirsty fascist genocidaire.

I struggle to articulate how absurd and evil it is, that they're eagerly destroying themselves just to spill more blood, just to slaughter and spread terror and death and misery for the sake of monstrous fascist ideals. Self-interested evil is horrible enough, but they're beyond even that, it's just death and horror for the sake of death and horror and fascist supremacy. All they have to do is not fucking do that, it's in their best interests to not fucking do that, but their twisted fascist ideology demands they sacrifice themselves for the sake of genocide.

[–] FunkyStuff@hexbear.net 39 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)

Maybe this is a bit irrelevant, but do you ever think of the Red Army seeing the absolutely vile atrocities the Nazis were doing, and how they found the will to keep going to stop them at all costs? I wonder if it's more demoralizing than not, I can only imagine that finding death camps with piles of childrens' clothing with their owners nowhere to be found has to really make you feel like any semblance of good in the world you're fighting for has already been lost.

And I guess it's just crazy that the Zionists are fighting to create that world, to create a world where the most defenseless are thrown to the mass graves and forgotten. How have they found the will to make it this far? How can fascist ideology push people to do as much harm as they've already done without putting a bullet through their CO's skull and then their own? Isn't it too much after you kill the second or third kid?

[–] SkingradGuard@hexbear.net 33 points 2 weeks ago

Isn't it too much after you kill the second or third kid?

For the last 80 years they've been told that the people they're killing aren't human beings. At a point they check out and are okay with it.

[–] CarbonScored@hexbear.net 13 points 2 weeks ago

seeing the absolutely vile atrocities

I can see it giving me nightmares, PTSD, etc. But personally, this really would strengthen my resolve to keep going, the knowledge that these atrocities are out there and we can stop it by continuing to march, that's a good reason.

All said, it'd still be a heavy burden on the mind, which can leave one acting irrationally after too long.

[–] GlueBear@hexbear.net 18 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

It's the first one. It's not that they see the people they're fighting as human, it's that they keep getting washed and burned out.

[–] KobaCumTribute@hexbear.net 33 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

It's not that they see the people they're fighting as human

I'm saying that's not a shield against it. Genocidaires dehumanize their victims and they still get fucked up by their own actions and what they're taking part in. It's not about morals or consciences or anything like that, it's just people not handling that sort of violence and horror well at a fundamental level. That's not to say "oh it makes them sad, it makes them unhappy, it makes them regretful" because it can just as easily make them worse and more violent and unstable, it's just to say it's something that actively attacks and corrodes their own humanity. They can psych themselves up and dehumanize their victims and beat their chest as loud as they want, as loud as they need to to push themselves to actually do it, but they're still going to be broken by it in some way.

This isn't something original to Israel, obviously, though that provides a very clear and visible example of a population trying to keep themselves whipped into a bloodthirsty frenzy and breaking at the seams because of it. I know it happened to the Nazis too, and that there's research on that and how Nazi ideology tried to recuperate that self-destruction through violence by lionizing it and making it a pillar of their ideology. I'd assume it's just a universal phenomenon, that such violence just kind of does that to people regardless of how they try to psych themselves up and cope with it.

[–] GlueBear@hexbear.net 11 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

I mean some people that work at abattoirs have PTSD, it's not unique to seeing humans slaughtered.

I think both things are true. The same way someone who works in the business of slaughtering barn animals won't go vegan or even vegetarian, even if they have PTSD.

It's got almost nothing to do with "seeing too much slaughter" in the case of the iof. It's actually laughable (and sad) that some people on this site really think those people are somehow getting tired and traumatized by the genocide.

The iof literally say why they're feeling this way, it's quoted in the article

"They return to the same buildings that they cleaned, each time trapping them anew. They have been to Al-Zaytoun neighborhood three times already. They understand that it is futile and pointless.”

They feel that they're doing meaningless busy work that's also getting them killed. Mind you, if they thought their slaughter was actually doing something they'll happily keep it up so long as they're not getting fucking washed by resistance fighters.

[–] CarbonScored@hexbear.net 10 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (1 children)

I'd argue it's laughable and sad that some people on this site really think these people are entirely unable to get tired and traumatized by the genocide. We know that even the worst of the worst of WW2 Nazis couldn't face gunning down their victims en masse, it'll be little better for the IOF.

Does it mean they're good people who will protest genocide tomorrow? No. But it does mean they're humans who will only physically take so much of doing it. Just because they're a genocidal force that must be stopped doesn't mean we need to deny they have innately human traits.

[–] Chronographs@lemmy.zip 4 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

To add to this, to paint Nazis, Israelis, anyone committing atrocities as inhuman monsters is to fool yourself into thinking there’s something different or other about them. This is just what happens when people grow up brainwashed into hate and conscripted into the army. Normal humans are going to feel bad butchering people, they’ll justify it to themselves and keep doing it but unless they’re psychopaths (which is uncommon) they’ll still have a physiological reaction.

[–] MattsAlt@hexbear.net 24 points 2 weeks ago

Definitely the first, the West doesn't want to die for treats

[–] AssortedBiscuits@hexbear.net 15 points 2 weeks ago

It's absolutely the first one. When's the last time you've heard a conquistador or a member of the 7th Cavalry get PTSD from butchering the Indigenous? But once the colonizers start getting their ass handed to them by the colonized is when the crocodile tears and whining about PTSD start coming out.

[–] FunkYankkkees@hexbear.net 42 points 2 weeks ago
[–] qocu@hexbear.net 39 points 2 weeks ago

We need those rookie numbers of suicides due to depression to start increasing.

[–] BeamBrain@hexbear.net 39 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (1 children)

I'm reminded of that anecdote from Wretched of the Earth where a colonial cop who'd been made his department's designated torturer went to Fanon for help because his job was destroying him emotionally. When Fanon advised the cop to quit his job, the cop said that no, he didn't want to quit his job, he wanted Fanon to make him okay with doing his job.

Fanon doesn't say he responded by pushing the cop out of a window, but it would have been entirely warranted.

[–] Venat@hexbear.net 9 points 2 weeks ago

Tony Soprano energy.

[–] Hestia@hexbear.net 36 points 2 weeks ago

They should crawl into a hole and die. barbara-pit

[–] SoyViking@hexbear.net 33 points 2 weeks ago

They can stop, leave Palestine and go home at any moment. Yet they choose to stay and do more genocide, more war crimes, more apartheid. All while whining over how they are the real victims. I couldn't have less sympathy for these monsters, I hope the terror of their actions will eat them up until there's nothing left for them to do but to beg for death.

[–] vegeta1@hexbear.net 33 points 2 weeks ago

Now imagine how the citizens of countries you're attack are.

[–] Seasonal_Peace@hexbear.net 32 points 2 weeks ago

Hope the resistance helps them to get rid of that mental damage by adding physical damage.

[–] Asafum@feddit.nl 32 points 2 weeks ago

Bibi and US media: Isreal military infested with antisemitic Jews! Don't think about it too hard, just send more weapons!

[–] tactical_trans_karen@hexbear.net 28 points 2 weeks ago

nicholson-yes

Real sicko shit coming from me. I got PTSD from being a colonizer in Iraq; I deserved worse and so do these fucking demons. God willing, their sins will find them and stop them one way or another.

[–] glimmer_twin@hexbear.net 23 points 2 weeks ago

They were already mentally damaged by the zio brainwashing that led them to this point. Good to see their programming is shattering their psyches as it crashes up against reality. It’d be real sad if they all unalived!

[–] Evilsandwichman@hexbear.net 20 points 2 weeks ago

God I wish the tank in that picture would fire

[–] Snackuleata@hexbear.net 19 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

Boy what a great time to have morale issues after you piss off all your neighbors.

[–] OnlyTrueLiberal@hexbear.net 18 points 2 weeks ago
[–] dkr567@hexbear.net 16 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

They can not drop bombs and snipe kids if their loser ground forces all "burnt out" but zionists aren't normal so I hope those PTSD are going well for them.

[–] Sausage@hexbear.net 14 points 2 weeks ago

I went to Kasol a village in northern India where all the hashish is produced it was full of Israelis with PTSD smoking their brains away. It was pretty sad.

[–] merthyr1831@lemmy.ml 9 points 2 weeks ago

Just a side note whilst I'm scrolling past again

motherfucker leaning solemnly over the barrel of tank cannon? lmao

[–] Eldritch@hexbear.net 9 points 2 weeks ago

Hopefully them and their scab shrinks commit [redacted]