A community for discussing events around the World
Rule 1: posts have the following requirements:
Rule 2: Do not copy the entire article into your post. The key points in 1-2 paragraphs is allowed (even encouraged!), but large segments of articles posted in the body will result in the post being removed. If you have to stop and think "Is this fair use?", it probably isn't. Archive links, especially the ones created on link submission, are absolutely allowed but those that avoid paywalls are not.
Rule 3: Opinions articles, or Articles based on misinformation/propaganda may be removed. Sources that have a Low or Very Low factual reporting rating or MBFC Credibility Rating may be removed.
Rule 4: Posts or comments that are homophobic, transphobic, racist, sexist, anti-religious, or ableist will be removed. “Ironic” prejudice is just prejudiced.
Posts and comments must abide by the lemmy.world terms of service UPDATED AS OF 10/19
Rule 5: Keep it civil. It's OK to say the subject of an article is behaving like a (pejorative, pejorative). It's NOT OK to say another USER is (pejorative). Strong language is fine, just not directed at other members. Engage in good-faith and with respect! This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban.
Similarly, if you see posts along these lines, do not engage. Report them, block them, and live a happier life than they do. We see too many slapfights that boil down to "Mom! He's bugging me!" and "I'm not touching you!" Going forward, slapfights will result in removed comments and temp bans to cool off.
Rule 6: Memes, spam, other low effort posting, reposts, misinformation, advocating violence, off-topic, trolling, offensive, regarding the moderators or meta in content may be removed at any time.
Rule 7: We didn't USED to need a rule about how many posts one could make in a day, then someone posted NINETEEN articles in a single day. Not comments, FULL ARTICLES. If you're posting more than say, 10 or so, consider going outside and touching grass. We reserve the right to limit over-posting so a single user does not dominate the front page.
We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.
All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.
News !news@lemmy.world
Politics !politics@lemmy.world
World Politics !globalpolitics@lemmy.world
For Firefox users, there is media bias / propaganda / fact check plugin.
https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/media-bias-fact-check/
got it wrong
No? No they got exactly what they wanted. They'll be able to annex all of Gaza and eventually the west bank.
They sacrificed their people to accomplish their colonist goals.The plan went swimmingly.
Correct, which is exactly the same thing the Zionist Federation of Germany did during WWII. They sold out their own people in order to keep much of their assets while beginning the process of annexing British Mandatory Palestine.
Make no mistake, these same Zionists went on to form Lehi, among other terrorist/militant organizations that share a direct link to modern day Likud. Every policy the modern right wing Israeli government has employed they borrowed directly from the Third Reich's playbook.
They are literally genocidal, ethno-supremacist, crypto-fascist psycopaths. In no way is that hyperbole. They are essentially Israeli Nazi's.
Gonna look into this myself later, but I hope you're lying. That would be some fucked up shit
Go read that Wikipedia information I linked. This isn't some rabbit hole conspiracy theory. There were multiple attempts by Zionist militant groups (including Lehi) to actively align with Nazi Germany against Britain during WWII. The context is more nuanced than what I am going to be able to explain in a comment here, but I encourage you to research the inter-war period of British Mandatory Palestine that lead up to the modern Israeli state.
Reading though it now and you're pretty spot on. Obviously there's a lot more nuance, but seeking an alliance with literal Nazis isn't a good look.
Btw, your link to Lehi is broken.
Though the money was meant for Gazan civilians, Western intelligence determined that Hamas was taking money from the funds to use themselves, the outlet reported.
Yep, sure totally meant for civilians guys, wads of money in suitcases. Nothing to see here, a totally legit way of sending funds to civilians.
The US did that with pallets of cash in Afghanistan, but that was explicitly money for warlords. No one tried to hide it. It was completely different.
"I learned it from you"
if you're american, that's suitcases of your money going to terrorists because the corrupt right wing ruling authority of israel would sacrifice unarmed civilians in both israel and palestine to avoid a peace deal. the israeli government is not just rejecting individual proposed peace deals but sabotaging any attempt at peace because they need constant war and fear to stay in power. Bibi Netanyahu will kill your baby himself with his hands if he thinks it will help him remain in power. He's a war criminal who deserves the Hague.
between this, the pullout in afghanistan and henry kissinger's entire career, I have to wonder if there's a terrorist anywhere on earth that isn't shooting american guns and spending american money.
If imperialism was a timeshare...
I mean this isn't anything new. We've known this since at least 2015 when ex-IDF top brass officials that worked in Gaza during the occupation have come clean about it in interviews. And the motivation behind this is also logical. The palestinian authority was playing the white man's game. They were going through the UN, filing motions against Israel, passing resolutions, and so on. Hamas is much easier to deal with. They don't bother with all that civilised bureaucratic stuff, in part because no one recognizes them anyway. It's easier to drop bombs on Hamas than on PA officials and thus continue the illegal occupation. As the current Israeli president has put it in an interview before: "Hamas is an asset" for Israel. [1] They're easier to work with.
[1] https://theintercept.com/2023/10/14/hamas-israel-palestinian-authority/
They fed a monster to destroy diplomacy and then act surprised when the monster mauled them.
Because it then gives justification to seize the land
I doubt it was the initial plan but that certainly seems to be how they are rolling now. Now they have a solid casus belli to justify massive bombing on a population.
Here the original & complete NY times article, for those who want to read what they have written, and not what is speculated.
This isn't a new discovery, is it? People already know about this, it's been like this for years. This has always been one of Netanyahu's many criticisms, even at home.
It's important to make the distinction between the Israeli religious authority funneling money to Hamas to create a political antagonist to the PLO/PA in the '90-'00s, and the object of this article.
Then there's money coming from all over the world as support to Palestine. They need this money to buy food/commodities from the rest of the world. Israel has always overseen this flow of money, just like they and Egypt keep watch over which goods enter and leave.
This money was always passed to the PA as executive government of Palestine. But since 2006, Hamas took control of Gaza. So the aid money goes to Hamas. And because Hamas can't have a bank account, it's brought in cash.
How would the world have reacted if Israel had blocked aid money from entering Gaza since 2006? How many Gazans would have died?
Right, but Gaza needs aid because Israel has blockaded Gaza for decades (which Israel has claimed was an act of war when Egypt blockaded Israel). If Israel lifted the blockade, then they wouldn't need to worry about funneling aid to Gaza.
It's just an inconvenient one. It makes it a lot harder to jerk about how "complex" the situation is when there's such an obvious villain. Everything Hamas has done, Netanyahu is an accomplice to.
The only complexity here is for people who can't fathom the concept of two bad guys. The only good people here are the civilians being happily sacrificed for Hamas and Netanyahu. Their leaders sip cocktails in luxury and don't care about how many die.
It's from the U.S. tyranny playbook: Allow a tragedy to happen, and then you get the support of the people to do whatever it takes to stop terrorism such as Pearl Harbor and 9/11.
This is every colonizer's playbook: you make constant small incursions, then when the people finally push back, you use it as an excuse to wipe them out and take the land.
In 2018, Netanyahu's administration came up with a plan, according to the New York Times. As part of a peace agreement with Hamas, Qatar would bring millions into Gaza to distribute to Gazan families, the outlet reported. (...)
Though the money was meant for Gazan civilians, Western intelligence determined that Hamas was taking money from the funds to use themselves, the outlet reported.
Let's take this at face value. 1) Why has Israeli media decried all sort of help towards Gaza Palestinians as "financing terrorism" if Netanyahu was willing to send them money himself? 2) If the Israeli government wanted to provide financial support to Palestinian civilians in Gaza, why not make the peace deal public? Why not establish criteria of transparency to make sure that the money got where it should have? 3) If you're willing to send money to Gaza, why not send the required supplies yourself, when you're the main country blockading it?
If we accept the narrative of the article, it is like Israel wanted the money to be misused.
Israel is set to wipe Gaza off the map. Of course they wanted the money to be misused.
Does everybody not understand Israel's goal is to eliminate Gaza and the West bank and replace them with Israeli settlements? They've been doing it for years.
That's US taxpayer money. Mazel tov!
This shit makes my blood boil. I need to find an article on the 2006 Palestinian elections. I have heard that Bush kind of forced it on them and there were a bunch of centrist leaders on there that split the vote so Hamas was able to get in power.
It seems that Israel needs Hamas in power to be the boogey man, so they can justify their horrific apartheid policies
im glad they're finally talking about this in western media.
Israeli security officials got it wrong; they didn’t think Hamas was capable, or even interested, in launching a large attack against the Jewish state.
I wholeheartedly don't think they cared. Netanyahu and the other far right Knesset officials clearly knew about the impending attack, clearly they might as well have killed those people themselves.
they literally did. that is what "allowing an action you could have stopped" means. They chose killing.
As part of a peace agreement with Hamas, Qatar would bring millions into Gaza to distribute to Gazan families, the outlet reported.
Israel should have allowed this!
Hamas takes all that money, historically, and gives little or nothing to the people of Gaza. They literally deny the UNRWA the ability to distribute material aid.
Remember Israel also stole Palestinians tax money. Effectively charging them for their own imprisonment
Americans meanwhile: "Hey, um we're all going bankrupt and COL is insane and student loan payments just started back up again and my mortgage is up for renewal and no one can afford to receive medical attention, but keep donating billions of dollars to a country that doesn't need donations!"
To an apartheid regime actively murdering civilians through collective punishment
Wasn't this so they can justify not doing a 2statesolution on the world stage?
wtaf
It makes a sick kind of sense. If you're one of the conservatives in power in Israel, and you oppose a two-state solution that would give Palestinians autonomy, keep two weaker factions fighting each other rather than stabilizing a new country.
It doesn't excuse the inhuman barbarism committed by Hamas against civilians, but it does mean Netanyahu should be immediately removed from power and arrested.
The Palestinian Authority is the only organization there with any actual legitimacy, and had Israel publicly, openly supported it, Hamas could never have gotten a foothold, while the Palestinian Authority would have had reason to normalize relations with Israel.
It's not necessarily new information, just that the NYT has conglomerated everything we already knew into a single article.
But it's been pretty well known that Netanyahu and Israel were responsible for Hamas existing and being funded in the first place, in order to undermine the Palestinian Authority that was actually making progress toward a two state solution, which Israel really hasn't been in support of for decades, but had to pretend they supported to stay the "good guys".
Are you surprised the genocidal regime that has been slowly eradicating a whole people for the past 70+ years could go this far?
The New York Times is late to this party. We've known about it since 2019.
Thus, amid this bid to impair Abbas, Hamas was upgraded from a mere terror group to an organization with which Israel held indirect negotiations via Egypt, and one that was allowed to receive infusions of cash from abroad.
The symbiotic relationship between Netanyahu and Hamas, The Hill, October 22, 2023
Netanyahu’s policy, however, was in direct opposition to most of the Israeli defense and security establishment, which viewed cooperation with the PA to be in Israel’s security interest. Fans of the Netflix series “Fauda” will recognize that cooperation. Most security experts felt the PA needed to be strengthened, not weakened.
Since returning to power in 2009, Netanyahu made no secret of his desire to keep Hamas and the PA apart for his own political purposes. For example, in 2017, the PA and Hamas were negotiating a possible takeover by the PA of civilian control of the Gaza Strip. Even though the United States and Egypt supported this reconciliation, Netanyahu was adamantly opposed — lest it empower the PA.
Why Netanyahu helped fund Hamas and how that backfired for Israel, India Today, November 1, 2023
“Whoever is against a Palestinian state should be for transferring the funds to Gaza, because maintaining a separation between the Palestinian Authority in the West Bank and Hamas in Gaza helps prevent the establishment of a Palestinian state,” The Jerusalem Post quoted Prime Minister Netanyahu as saying in 2019.
Prince Turki al-Faisal's accusation against Israel comes days after a report by Reuters, citing a source privy to the matter, stated that Qatar's financial aid to the Palestinian families in Gaza passes through Israel. The funds are transferred electronically from Qatar to Israel, following which Israeli and United Nations (UN) officials hand-carry the same over the border to the Gaza Strip.
How Netanyahu's Hamas policy came back to haunt him — and Israel, CBC News, October 28, 2023
Yuval Diskin, former head of Israel's Shin Bet security service, told the daily newspaper Yedioth Ahronoth in 2013 that "if we look at it over the years, one of the main people contributing to Hamas's strengthening has been Bibi Netanyahu, since his first term as prime minister."
In August 2019, former prime minister Ehud Barak told Israeli Army Radio that Netanyahu's "strategy is to keep Hamas alive and kicking … even at the price of abandoning the citizens [of the south] … in order to weaken the Palestinian Authority in Ramallah."
Netanyahu's current finance minister, West Bank settler Belazel Smotrich, explained the approach to Israel's Knesset channel in 2015: "Hamas is an asset, and (Palestinian Authority leader) Abu Mazen (Mahmoud Abbas) is a burden."
"But each time Netanyahu was asked, 'Why don't you negotiate with Abbas,' he would say, 'I can't negotiate with a Palestinian Authority that doesn't represent all Palestinians.' And so he would use Hamas and this division to justify his absolute objection to any negotiated peace agreement."
“Both Egypt and Qatar are angry with Hamas and planned to cut ties with them. Suddenly Netanyahu appears as the defender of Hamas, as though it was an environmental organization. This is a policy of submission to terror,” he said, adding that Israel was paying Hamas “protection money” to maintain the calm.
The prime minister also said that, “whoever is against a Palestinian state should be for” transferring the funds to Gaza, because maintaining a separation between the PA in the West Bank and Hamas in Gaza helps prevent the establishment of a Palestinian state.
This is the best summary I could come up with:
Israeli officials are facing backlash after years of Prime Minister Benjamin "Bibi" Netanyahu quietly allowing Hamas to remain in power.
The calculus — the Times reported on Sunday, citing Israeli officials, Netanyahu's critics, and the man's own reported statements — was to keep Hamas strong enough to counteract the Palestinian Authority in the West Bank, allowing Netanyahu to avoid a two-state peace solution and keep both sides weak.
Israeli security officials got it wrong; they didn't think Hamas was capable, or even interested, in launching a large attack against the Jewish state.
As part of a peace agreement with Hamas, Qatar would bring millions into Gaza to distribute to Gazan families, the outlet reported.
Israeli security officials would meet with a Qatari diplomat at the border between Israel and Jordan, according to the New York Times report.
The propped-up peace lasted until October 7, when Hamas fighters launched a terror attack across the Israeli border.
The original article contains 348 words, the summary contains 155 words. Saved 55%. I'm a bot and I'm open source!