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this post was submitted on 31 Dec 2023
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Sorry by common sense i meant my military training common sense would lead me to shoot anyone with a gun if i were committing a crime with a gun.
Squid, we have different views, thats fine but im just trying to explain my point of view. You obviously have me confused with someone else as ive not argued for anything faith based at all. Im not a conservative and you assuming that is probably why youre thinking people are arguing in bad faith. When i said no one wants to do the research that includes the US govt. i gave no justifications as to why no one wants to do research.
No, I'm not assuming you are a conservative. I am saying these "common sense" arguments are faith-based much like a lot of conservative thinking, which is why I am saying it shouldn't be done.
Doesn't it strike you as even a little odd that, despite multiple people telling me that a shooter will take out the armed civilian first, not a single person has actually given an example of this? I'm not talking about a statistical survey, I'm talking about even one example.
The only answer I have received so far from anyone that doesn't rely on "this makes sense to me even though I can't prove it" is the person who says it isn't about a deterrent, it's about feeling safe. And I wish that's what everyone else had said because at least you don't need evidence for that sort of claim. On the other hand, it's a little hard to justify laws based on what makes you feel safe considering that's a big impetus for the drug war.
Most people arent going to research a social media comment to justify a belief that doesnt matter. So no, i dont find it even a little odd.
Thank you for admitting that evidence and data doesn't matter to you when it comes to the law, all that matters is your faith-based belief. That was my point.
Man, people must really love you if you twist words like that. The comment was meant in the general sense not the specific argument we’re having about weapons. Im not responding past this because you obviously just want to argue. Good day.
So in the "general sense" people shouldn't supply evidence for their claims. I see.
Amazing how many people in this thread just twist themselves into pretzels rather than just say they can't back up their claim and just want the law to reflect what they feel is right.
Although admittedly "no one is going to back up what they say on Lemmy because it doesn't matter" is a new one. Why even be in a news community if you don't care about evidence?
Kinda like the "common sense" anti-2a crowd...laws based on emotion not reality...but here is some evidence of why open carry is stupid. It is hard to get a study on why open carry is worse than concealed because there probably isn't enough data out there to prove it deters a criminal... it's not like you can go ask them.
https://youtu.be/fjoF8b5XVow?feature=shared
https://youtu.be/wPEaX4HwWyc?feature=shared
https://youtu.be/idgT9HBiJiM?feature=shared
https://youtu.be/XFvU2sdM0DY?feature=shared
https://youtu.be/lVsKnE0AP6c?feature=shared
Okay. Finally. Some evidence.
Now, after reviewing the first one and before reviewing the others- would it be fair to say that, like the first one and the man talking about the issue in the first video, the problem is not openly carrying, but openly carrying with a holster that would make it easy to steal from?
Because that is a different argument.
The other videos comment on why open carry is not a good idea. Open carry while is done by police, do have proper retention holsters. That in itself can cause issues, but open carry does make you a target.
Okay, which of those videos best explains why it is a bad idea even with a retention holster? Because, again, otherwise the argument is not 'open carry is less safe,' it's 'open carry a certain way is less safe,' which is something I think no one will argue with you about.
https://youtu.be/idgT9HBiJiM?feature=shared
Try this one, dude is targeted for the firearm being valuable. Retention or not, you become a target. That's the whole issue, visibility of the firearm. To me, open carry does not deter crime, I'd say it's asking to be targeted. Same with those idiots who drive around with the gun stickers on their trucks... they're fucking idiots.
That sounds like an argument for not having valuable things in places where people can easily steal them, not that open carry is inherently less safe.
We've also gone from "someone coming in to shoot the place up is going to target the armed civilian first" to "this man was specifically targeted for his valuable gun." A little disingenuous, don't you think?