this post was submitted on 19 Jul 2023
1 points (54.5% liked)

Lefty Memes

4352 readers
445 users here now

An international (English speaking) socialist Lemmy community free of the "ML" influence of instances like lemmy.ml and lemmygrad. This is a place for undogmatic shitposting and memes from a progressive, anti-capitalist and truly anti-imperialist perspective, regardless of specific ideology.

Serious posts, news, and discussion go in c/Socialism.

If you are new to socialism, you can ask questions and find resources over on c/Socialism101.

Please don't forget to help keep this community clean by reporting rule violations, updooting good contributions and downdooting those of low-quality!

Rules

Version without spoilers

0. Only post socialist memes


That refers to funny image macros and means that generally videos and screenshots are not allowed. Exceptions include explicitly humorous and short videos, as well as (social media) screenshots depicting a funny situation, joke, or joke picture relating to socialist movements, theory, societal issues, or political opponents. Examples would be the classic case of humorous Tumblr or Twitter posts/threads. (and no, agitprop text does not count as a meme)


1. Socialist Unity in the form of mutual respect and good faith interactions is enforced here


Try to keep an open mind, other schools of thought may offer points of view and analyses you haven't considered yet. Also: This is not a place for the Idealism vs. Materialism or rather Anarchism vs. Marxism debate(s), for that please visit c/AnarchismVsMarxism.


2. Anti-Imperialism means recognizing capitalist states like Russia and China as such


That means condemning (their) imperialism, even if it is of the "anti-USA" flavor.


3. No liberalism, (right-wing) revisionism or reactionaries.


That includes so called: Social Democracy, Democratic Socialism, Dengism, Market Socialism, Patriotic Socialism, National Bolshevism, Anarcho-Capitalism etc. . Anti-Socialist people and content have no place here, as well as the variety of "Marxist"-"Leninists" seen on lemmygrad and more specifically GenZedong (actual ML's are welcome as long as they agree to the rules and don't just copy paste/larp about stuff from a hundred years ago).


4. No Bigotry.


The only dangerous minority is the rich.


5. Don't demonize previous and current socialist experiments or (leading) individuals.


We must constructively learn from their mistakes, while acknowledging their achievements and recognizing when they have strayed away from socialist principles.

(if you are reading the rules to apply for modding this community, mention "Mantic Minotaur" when answering question 2)


6. Don't idolize/glorify previous and current socialist experiments or (leading) individuals.


Notable achievements in all spheres of society were made by various socialist/people's/democratic republics around the world. Mistakes, however, were made as well: bureaucratic castes of parasitic elites - as well as reactionary cults of personality - were established, many things were mismanaged and prejudice and bigotry sometimes replaced internationalism and progressiveness.



  1. Absolutely no posts or comments meant to relativize(/apologize for), advocate, promote or defend:

founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
 

I won't be debating this, don't bother.

you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[โ€“] NotAPenguin@kbin.social -2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

There's protein in plant based cat food.

You didn't answer the question, though - how do you feel about the morality of topsoil degradation, greenhouse emissions and biodiversity reduction caused by most vegan food alternatives?

I did; Most farm land is used for animal feed., so plant based food uses way less farm land and thus causes way less degradation and emissions.

If you consider the "capability to consider the consequences of one's actions" as the ultimate method of determining if killing is OK or not... then you should be equally fine with mentally disturbed humans killing other humans. Are you?

Mentally disturbed humans who act violently are still humans and part of our pack, I think we should make sure they don't hurt others.

Which conditions? The majority of farms - sure, the conditions are horrible and it's exactly what I'm saying we should eliminate.

The conditions of "humane" treatment but still killing.

But there are modern farms that have conditions most of the human population would gladly sign up for.

You seriously think that humans would sign up to get needlessly killed for profit/taste..?

Precisely my point. That being said, there are a myriad of methods of killing an animal without being cruel.

How do you ethically kill someone who doesn't need or want to die?

[โ€“] Alaknar@kbin.social -1 points 1 year ago

I did; Most farm land is used for animal feed., so plant based food uses way less farm land and thus causes way less degradation and emissions.

Most is not all... Also: if we practically eliminate the meat industry, the "vegan farms" need to grow as well. It's not like all that land that's currently being degraded for animal feed will be freed to recover. No, it will still be producing environmentally catastrophic food - but for humans directly.

Mentally disturbed humans who act violently are still humans and part of our pack, I think we should make sure they don't hurt others

That's not an answer to my question, though. You posited that only the "capability of understanding that you're causing harm" determines whether killing is OK or not.

Wild animals do not have that capacity, therefore them killing other animals is OK.

Which means that humans with damaged cognitive abilities (like psychopaths, sadists, etc) killing other humans without the realisation of the hurt they're causing... Is also OK.

You seriously think that humans would sign up to get needlessly killed for profit/taste..?

Yes.

How do you ethically kill someone who doesn't need or want to die?

So here we come back to my previous question: how to you prevent wild animals from killing other wild animals who most definitely don't want (or, in many cases, need) to die?

And also my other previous question: how do you ethically deforest swathes of land, destroying topsoil and biodiversity, ALSO killing lots of animals in the process - directly or, mostly, indirectly, through the removal of their natural hunting/feeding grounds and condemning them to starvation?

EDIT: changed the link to an even more appropriate one. The previous link, for those interested, HERE.