this post was submitted on 11 Jul 2023
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ErgoMechKeyboards

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Ergonomic, split and other weird keyboards

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Keep it ergo

Posts must be of/about keyboards that have a clear delineation between the left and right halves of the keyboard, column stagger, or both. This includes one-handed (one half doesn't exist, what clearer delineation is that!?)

i.e. no regular non-split¹ row-stagger and no non-split¹ ortholinear²

¹ split meaning a separation of the halves, whether fixed in place or entirely separate, both are fine.
² ortholinear meaning keys layed out in a grid

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Three more Svalboards went into the world this week! (lemmy.world)
submitted 1 year ago by claussen@lemmy.world to c/ergomechkeyboards@lemmy.world
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I call this one Daisy ;) This set went to a user in Alabama. Units also shipped to Poland and Eureka CA. So hype for more feedback from early users! Current build queue is a couple weeks long, feel free to jump in if you want one!

Svalboard is my Datahand style small-volume production keyboard -- I build every one by hand here in Pacifica, CA.

Learn more at [www.svalboard.com] and come check out the Datahand/Svalboard/lalboard discord https://discord.gg/kqNhKjxca where we geek out about this stuff!

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[–] redchlorophyll@lemmy.world 14 points 1 year ago (4 children)

You guys really hate traditional typing methods, eh?

[–] claussen@lemmy.world 13 points 1 year ago

When traditional methods literally cripple you... yeah. This isn't a hobby thing, it's more like a survival tool/prosthesis -- RSI is way more prevalent than a lot of folks realize, and for people who make a living typing, it's worth a lot of adaptation. I wish nobody needed my weird keyboards, but damn there are a lot of us RSI cripples out here! The weird-keeb enthusiasts are just a niche submarket in that context. :)

[–] sin_free_for_00_days@lemmy.one 11 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Once you try a different keyboard, and like it, you wonder what else you've been missing out on.

[–] redchlorophyll@lemmy.world 7 points 1 year ago (2 children)

I wish I could but man, I can't even get used to a Xbox style controller for gaming, much less a different keyboard layout. More power to ya tho. I may not understand it, but the boards y'all pump out are novel.

[–] sin_free_for_00_days@lemmy.one 6 points 1 year ago (4 children)

Most of the weird-looking keyboards have the same QWERTY layout. If you can touch type, they don't take long to get used to. I personally don't get the people that change their keyboards to DVORAK or COLEMAK (Not sure why I shout those names, just the way I tend to write them). More power to them, but I think if I changed the layouts like that it would take me months to get back up to speed.

[–] claussen@lemmy.world 6 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

If you don't have RSI or fatigue issues, then yeah, QWERTY's fine. I've been using QWERTY on Datahand for years. But the increase in comfort going to Dvorak/Colemak is huge, reducing the frequency of the worst movements. Dvorak basically fixed my dad's RSI issues and he made the change at like age 65!

[–] sin_free_for_00_days@lemmy.one 3 points 1 year ago

I tried out Colemak for a couple months about 10-15 years ago. I just could not get my stupid head to wrap around it. Knock on wood I haven't had any pain issues, but I've been using an ergodox since I got one of those group buy ones that I had to solder together. I actually bought a stenography keyboard recently. I'm trying to spend a little bit each day learning it, but I expect that to take years.

[–] norawibb@sh.itjust.works 2 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

I use Colemak. The issue is not learning the layout really, although it does take some time. The issue is now your QWERTY ability is gone so you look like a caveman any time you have to type on a device that isn't yours. It took me just as much time to forget Colemak and go back to QWERTY.

However, I recently decided to learn Colemak while switching back to QWERTY intermittently to be able to use both. I guess I still have the muscle memory since I'm learning it much quicker this time, but my QWERTY is still perfectly fine.

tl;dr work is boring so im melting my brain with multiple keyboard layouts lol

[–] Leilys@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 1 year ago

I got a Sofle V2 and committed to using Colemak DHm on it. Typing's a bit awkward but relatively fluid on both keyboards, since split keyboard muscle memory is slightly different.

Not very good at mod layering myself, but it's been a pretty fun time. Only kind of sucks when my split is plugged in and I boot up a game and my character just backs off a cliff cuz it's not WASD.

[–] pixelprimer@lemmy.world 1 points 1 year ago

For me swapping to Colemak was mostly comfort as you move your fingers way less. Plus I never actually learned how to touch type on QWERTY anyway, so if I was going to have to learn why not something that’s just better hahaha. If I was comfortable on QWERTY and could touch type I probably wouldn’t have swapped.

[–] dpflug@hachyderm.io 1 points 1 year ago

@sin_free_for_00_days YMMV, but it only took me a month to get back to my previous speed when switching to Dvorak. Years later, I can still type QWERTY. A bit slower, but not unreasonable.

The difference in comfort is so stark I could never go back.

[–] claussen@lemmy.world 3 points 1 year ago (1 children)

what kind of controller are you used to? NES original, or? :D

[–] redchlorophyll@lemmy.world 2 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Haha, I grew up on the Gameboy Advanced, so pretty close! But most of my gaming happens with a good old mouse and keyboard.

[–] athos77@kbin.social 7 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

This looks like it's great for a disabled person: you can do the entire keyboard without moving anything other than your fingers, while your hand rests on a nice platform built to support it without fatigue. If it's something you need, it looks really nice!

[–] aesopjah@lemm.ee 1 points 1 year ago

Yep.

[–] NoamVokaal@lemmy.world 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

This looks incredible! I would love to build one myself one day, if you ever offer a kit. The assembled keyboard is out of my budget, unfortunately, but it makes me very happy to see your progress.

[–] claussen@lemmy.world 3 points 1 year ago (1 children)

working on that, if you have a MK3S or equivalent printer. where are you located?

[–] NoamVokaal@lemmy.world 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Wonderful! I do indeed own a 3D printer, and I live in Sweden. Quite far away from Pacifica …

[–] claussen@lemmy.world 1 points 1 year ago

Cool! Join the discord and ping @_claussen I'll keep you posted on the kit situation. Waiting on a new finger cluster PCBA rev to improve some assembly yield issues from the factory.

[–] Solemn@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Oof, would love to try it, but it's outside my budget for now. I'll live to regret that decision in another decade I'm sure.

Glad you're getting plenty of business for now though; maybe eventually there'll be enough interest to justify a factory run with some economy of scale.

[–] claussen@lemmy.world 2 points 1 year ago

Thanks, and fingers crossed! I'm trying out some SLA prototyping houses to see how modest volume runs could go, but of course that will take some time to sample and sort out all the kinks when handing off fab & assembly of the mechanicals to someone other than myself.

[–] Cris_Color@lemmy.world 2 points 1 year ago

This is fucking cool as hell, thanks for sharing! I enjoy the funky colors!

[–] series_editor@mander.xyz 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I would be interested to see how this compares to using a characorder, which is similar in concept but the switches are different. I feel like this would be a little easier to press.

fwiw, if any one is wondering, this or a cc would by far be the best single key entry typing experience you can get as far as comfort goes. the lack of wrist movement is incredible, your hands basically don't move all day. its much easier to stay in the zone when you don't have to worry about where your hands are, not having to reach for shortcuts, not having worry so much about keybinds or key placement because you can reach everything you need with ease.

most of these keyboards and layouts all just minimize wrist/finger movement for the most part, which this cuts down to nothing with any keyboard layout

[–] claussen@lemmy.world 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

We have a longtime DH user on the Discord who spent the past year on charachorder. He's giving it up -- reliability is awful with their poorly thought out hardware, the sticks fail super fast -- I think he went through like half a dozen units in a year :wide-eyes:

He liked it otherwise, but found the speed promises didn't really hold true, especially as a SWE. DH/Svalboard/lal typing is truly superb.

[–] series_editor@mander.xyz 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

that would make sense. i have had some issues too, only had to send one unit back though, which was why I think this may be better. i mostly use mine for some games and a macropad basically. i like the idea but am wondering about the long term reliability.

[–] claussen@lemmy.world 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I can guarantee you that Svalboard will last as long as you want to type, with anything that breaks also being easily replaceable. The lack of springs and electromechanical contacts is incredible for long term reliability -- my Datahand rigs are 20+ years old and all still basically work perfectly aside from one which I stupidly broke some keys on during travel, and some grunginess in one or two mechanisms probably due to dirt intrusion.

But with Svalboard the keys just drop right in and pull right out (in the right orientation), there's no mechanism to assemble -- so cleaning is as easy as popping the key out and blowing out the keywell with compressed air. And you can replace individual key clusters and PCBAs individually if needed. And print your own keys, etc. Suuuuuper maintainable. 😀 Tearing down an original Datahand for cleaning is a lot more involved and annoying, and can only be done to a limited extent.

[–] claussen@lemmy.world 1 points 1 year ago

I'd love to see some macropad users play with Svalboard. If you want to order one, I'll sell you a half for half price 😆 but obviously I'd prefer to build you a full rig 😜

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