this post was submitted on 01 Sep 2023
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It may seem like nothing... (i.imgur.com)
submitted 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) by WolfyGamer29@lemmy.world to c/linux@lemmy.ml
42 comments fedilink hide all child comments
 

But this picture of an empty desktop was far too long in the making. it took me a week to succesfully install Arch. I could do the process start to finish, blindfolded, at this point.

Finally, after endless hours of repeating the same steps over and over again, trying to word google searches in just the right way to get just that one specific answer to that one absurd issue, re-reading guides and links over and over again trying to find the single missed Sentence that ties everything together and finally. Finally.

It may seem kinda stupid to consider that an accomplishment, but I feel quite genuinely proud of myself for actually succeeding at this instead of just throwing in the towel and giving up like I usually do when I try and take on new hobbies, and don't immediately succeed.

ETA: Image fix!

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[–] ipsirc@lemmy.ml 58 points 1 year ago (3 children)

[–] minthenry@lemmy.one 7 points 1 year ago (6 children)

What's the alternative to using the wiki though? Asking for a friend.

[–] Acters@lemmy.world 5 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Automate it or create a pre-made install image, or simply use an already premade install image online as you are essentially having the same final install as everyone else following the guide. Following a guide without understanding the reasons behind each step is a counterintuitive way to learn. The goal is to install a GNU/Linux os on a computer. Gather the required information of what is needed for the installation. This can include the base components, the desired software and/or hardware to be used, and any extraneous needs that may come up from day to day usage. List out all the reasons for each component(software/hardware) and then decide how you wish for each to interact with each other or how they will be used. Layout a personal security policy and the necessary compromises to achieve a balance on usability and minimal risk to your data and system.

While this seems daunting, most of this is skip able as premade os images already are catered to common users. It is, however, the proper way to learn. Instead of just slamming together an OS install from a guide without realizing what you did or why it is needed, building a deeper understanding of the system and knowing the reasons for each step allows you to gain great insight and improvement on professional marketable computer skills.(be careful of accidentally over qualifying you in the interview, sometimes less is more)

There is plenty of documentation, and the arch wiki is just one of them to help you. Installing the Arch OS is the easiest part. It is the simplest goal, and it is the fun part of the process. The other parts are usually boring or need to be iterated over that can feel like a grind/large sink of tine and energy.

I hope my options don't dissuade you from practicing being in a terminal environment vs. the comfort of a GUI. This is an important skill for many users of Linux. There are many time-consuming stuff in this world, and I chose to plan installations and reading documentation for personal development. I may not be rich, but I am enjoying what I am doing.

[–] minthenry@lemmy.one 3 points 1 year ago

I did install Arch on a small home server which I'm not using anymore, I can't remember how I installed it, but I spent a lot of time on the wiki.

So thanks for the detailed explanation! I'm using Mint as my daily driver for gaming as my spare time is quite scarce and I don't want to spend most of it reading and learning really.

[–] escapesamsara 3 points 1 year ago

archinstall comes by default on medium now; there's also archfi and about a dozen other install scripts with varying levels of customization, interactivity, and ease of use. All of which are better options than wiki installation.

[–] Ludrol@szmer.info 2 points 1 year ago

Asking a friend

[–] Exec@pawb.social 1 points 1 year ago

obligatory without an install script

[–] doggle@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 1 year ago

Following any number of walkthroughs, like on YouTube for instance. Try to find a relatively recent one if you're taking that path. Or you could just use an Arch-based OS with an installer. I like Endeavor, it's pretty close to a basic Arch install with a DE pre setup for you.

Either way just don't ask for help on the Arch user forums if something doesn't work, unless you want to be swiftly RTFMed.

[–] astraeus@programming.dev 1 points 1 year ago

Run the included archinstall.sh

[–] dingleberry@discuss.tchncs.de 3 points 1 year ago

OS is meant to be the background, not the reason to boot up your computer.

[–] hai@lemmy.ml 2 points 1 year ago

I partially agree. Installing from a script saves time and energy, but installing manually allows you to learn and have a deeper understanding for your computer (along with giving you more control). I'd say install from scratch once, install from a script the rest of the time, in my opinion it's worth it to have the extra understanding of how everything works, and also then you can audit the script you'll be using.

[–] redcalcium@lemmy.institute 31 points 1 year ago

You have earned the right to use btw keyword in your future posts.

[–] BlueEther@no.lastname.nz 17 points 1 year ago (1 children)

but waht was the issue and the fix?

[–] WolfyGamer29@lemmy.world 30 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Well, at first I was doing it completely manually, following the installation guide, but I'd get so mixed up in the soup of it all with all those new terms and actions that felt completely foreign yo me. Then I found mention of the simple archinstall command which the guide either hadn't mentioned outright or the mentioning of it got drowned out by all the other words.

It took me a long minute to play around and work out how that worked, but once I finally figured out what was what and all that, I would finally start the install and it would get stuck.

It would get to "Waiting for systemd.timesyncd to complete" but it never would (and I gave it the benefit of the doubt at first, and just waited hours the first try.) On googling, I'd get a lot of approximate answers and explanations that almost but didn't quite match, and the solutions never worked. I'd give up for a bit and then go back to trying it, googling, and I started just trying to troubleshoot it on my own despite really not knowing what I was doing and just throwing random things at the wall and seeing what stuck.

Eventually though, I got the right keywords in the right order on google and came across a reddit post of someone with my exact issue. The solution after that was really, really simple. They had solved their issue by editing /etc/systemd/timesyncd.config, where multiple things were commented that shouldn't have been. I did the same thing and went into the .conf and lo and behold, the entire thing was commented, so I fixed that and boom. Working.

Honestly I'm actually glad that I had to go on such a wild goose chase to fix that little issue, because as frustrating and, in the end, useless that whole struggle ended up seeming, I learned a LOT while struggling. I've edited lots of .conf files, I love modding my games so I'm not shy to dipping my toes in and changing basic values, but did I know what the term "commenting" meant in that context, or even how that stuff worked on a deeper, technical level? Nope. Now I do! Now I know how to do some menial tasks via the console that I hadn't used before. I know better how the disks work, I have a better understanding of partitioning, etc.

I think I much prefered this experience over the one where I just popped in Linux Mint and everything was a-ok from the get-go.

[–] BaroqueInMind@kbin.social 13 points 1 year ago (2 children)

You are a testament to the fact that applying sheer willpower and stubbornness anyone can accomplish anything.

[–] rikudou@lemmings.world 11 points 1 year ago

Local man too angry to ~~die~~ not install Arch.

[–] boringbisexual@lib.lgbt 4 points 1 year ago

I saw one person say something along the lines of "repeatedly bashing my head against a wall until it breaks". I understood myself a little more after that.

[–] Nefyedardu@kbin.social 5 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I've had a lot of issues with archinstall in the past as well, doesn't surprise me that it wouldn't set your network clock correctly

[–] astraeus@programming.dev 2 points 1 year ago

I had to do some funky messing with networkd and the ntp sync stuff, seems like that’s the barrier to entry for vanilla arch these days

[–] dream_weasel@sh.itjust.works 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

So you were troubleshooting archinstall? I have never used it, but I would have thought the full manual Intel instructions were less opaque.

As a bit of advice for next time, you can do a YouTube search for an install that more or less follows the wiki. Kai Hendry comes to mind. It may demystify some of the parts.

[–] WolfyGamer29@lemmy.world 2 points 1 year ago

As logical and helpful as youtube tutorials can be, I just don't like them. Which is entirely a self-imposed problem, for sure, and there's lots of times where I'd have solved a problem quick and simple with a patient sit down with a two minute video. I think it's one of those ol' ADHD and/or Autism quirks, I can never sit still for tutorial videos and I intentionally avoid them because I get stressed thinking about watching them, which is definitely silly, but the human brain is often a silly thing...

That being said, I fully recognize the fact that it's absolutely my own fault when I run into issues like this one, so I never blame the software I'm fucking with lmao, just assume I messed up or am not being patient enough. Hence why I sat and stared at "Waiting for timesync to complete" for roughly 3~ hours before deciding that, yeah, it definitely wasn't completing this go around. And then three attempts later I decided to let it sit while I went to sleep, in the hopes that maybe, just maybe... (Spoiler, it did not complete while I was asleep, to no ones shock but my own)

I get a lot of "work smarter, not harder" advice... never seems to stick, clearly... It's fun though. It's mentally stimulating, if nothing else. Like trying to solve the worlds easiest rubix cube while running on -72 hours of sleep and zero caffeine. Infuriating to watch, but hard to get bored!

[–] lukas@lemmy.haigner.me 16 points 1 year ago

You can embed images directly into your post btw.

[–] kariboka@bolha.forum 14 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

please replace the link to the imgur album with the link to the picture. So people won't have to leave Lemmy to see it.

This is the link you want to use: https://i.imgur.com/ZIYnyJk.jpeg

[–] azron@lemmy.ml 10 points 1 year ago

The fight is how you learn :). Good job persevering.

[–] kariboka@bolha.forum 8 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

In case the OP does not update the link, this is the image:

[–] PriorProject@lemmy.world 5 points 1 year ago (1 children)

It may seem kinda stupid to consider that an accomplishment, but I feel quite genuinely proud of myself for actually succeeding at this instead of just throwing in the towel...

Way to go. I've been at this a decent while and do some pretty esoteric stuff at work and at home... but this loop of feeling stupid, doing the work, and feeling good about a success has been a constant throughout. I spent a week struggling to port some advanced container setups to podman a month or so ago, same feeling of pride when I got them humming.

It's not stupid to be proud of an accomplishment even if it's a fundamental one that's early in a bigger learning curve. Soak it in, then on to the next high. Good luck.

[–] harsh3466@lemmy.world 3 points 1 year ago

I love that feeling. I’ve recently been learning about zfs as I add it to my server and make use of it in my setup. In doing so I had to utilize my container and data backups to migrate data from a single drive to my new zfs raidz array. I felt damn accomplished after doing so!

[–] 1984@lemmy.today 5 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

You made it!

This was my experience too the first times. It was quite hard to get it booting, so many things to learn.

And the best part is, nothing else about Linux is more difficult to understand. It's all easier from here. Learning about systemd, or config files... It's easy compared to just getting that install to work.

[–] it_a_me@literature.cafe 4 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Congratulations and welcome. I use arch, btw

[–] sharkfucker420@sh.itjust.works 4 points 1 year ago

Welcome to the cool kids club 😎

[–] s20@lemmy.ml 4 points 1 year ago

It doesn't seem like nothing at all! Great job and welcome to the fam!

Wow this takes me back to the first time I set up a FreeBSD desktop. That sense of accomplishment, I mean, wow. I haven't felt that in a while.

Maybe I'll build a new system with Funtoo… or I could go real crazy and use NetBSD…

[–] pastermil@sh.itjust.works 3 points 1 year ago

Got me curious, what absurd issue did you run into? I've successfully installed Arch along with the DE & all the apps with no issue many times.

[–] technologicalcaveman@kbin.social 3 points 1 year ago

Nice job. I've been working on my gentoo system. I keep getting weird errors about nullmail not emerging correctly, but it only happens when I use binary flags. After I get that solved I'm updating my carry laptop to run openbsd, swapping fvm to xfce4 or dwm.

[–] w2qw@aussie.zone 2 points 1 year ago

Congrats, great DE choice too

[–] kool_newt@lemm.ee 2 points 1 year ago

Awesomeness

[–] eyolf@lemmy.world 1 points 1 year ago

All that - and then you end up using Gnome?!

[–] LovePoson@lemmy.world 1 points 1 year ago

Insert Evangelion Congratulations scene