this post was submitted on 17 Dec 2023
1000 points (98.8% liked)

News

23669 readers
3418 users here now

Welcome to the News community!

Rules:

1. Be civil


Attack the argument, not the person. No racism/sexism/bigotry. Good faith argumentation only. This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban. Do not respond to rule-breaking content; report it and move on.


2. All posts should contain a source (url) that is as reliable and unbiased as possible and must only contain one link.


Obvious right or left wing sources will be removed at the mods discretion. We have an actively updated blocklist, which you can see here: https://lemmy.world/post/2246130 if you feel like any website is missing, contact the mods. Supporting links can be added in comments or posted seperately but not to the post body.


3. No bots, spam or self-promotion.


Only approved bots, which follow the guidelines for bots set by the instance, are allowed.


4. Post titles should be the same as the article used as source.


Posts which titles don’t match the source won’t be removed, but the autoMod will notify you, and if your title misrepresents the original article, the post will be deleted. If the site changed their headline, the bot might still contact you, just ignore it, we won’t delete your post.


5. Only recent news is allowed.


Posts must be news from the most recent 30 days.


6. All posts must be news articles.


No opinion pieces, Listicles, editorials or celebrity gossip is allowed. All posts will be judged on a case-by-case basis.


7. No duplicate posts.


If a source you used was already posted by someone else, the autoMod will leave a message. Please remove your post if the autoMod is correct. If the post that matches your post is very old, we refer you to rule 5.


8. Misinformation is prohibited.


Misinformation / propaganda is strictly prohibited. Any comment or post containing or linking to misinformation will be removed. If you feel that your post has been removed in error, credible sources must be provided.


9. No link shorteners.


The auto mod will contact you if a link shortener is detected, please delete your post if they are right.


10. Don't copy entire article in your post body


For copyright reasons, you are not allowed to copy an entire article into your post body. This is an instance wide rule, that is strictly enforced in this community.

founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
 

Almost three years since the deadly Texas blackout of 2021, a panel of judges from the First Court of Appeals in Houston has ruled that big power companies cannot be held liable for failure to provide electricity during the crisis. The reason is Texas’ deregulated energy market.

The decision seems likely to protect the companies from lawsuits filed against them after the blackout. It leaves the families of those who died unsure where next to seek justice.

In February of 2021, a massive cold front descended on Texas, bringing days of ice and snow. The weather increased energy demand and reduced supply by freezing up power generators and the state’s natural gas supply chain. This led to a blackout that left millions of Texans without energy for nearly a week.

The state has said almost 250 people died because of the winter storm and blackout, but some analysts call that a serious undercount.

you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] TigrisMorte@kbin.social 269 points 1 year ago (8 children)

It is almost like natural monopolies, such as primary power generation and supply, should be under the control of the Government and not private individuals.

[–] girlfreddy@sh.itjust.works 103 points 1 year ago (3 children)

They all used to be. Then Reagan and Clinton happened.

[–] TigrisMorte@kbin.social 35 points 1 year ago (1 children)

ding ding ding. We have a winner! Give that man a prize!

[–] girlfreddy@sh.itjust.works 40 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Thank you, thank you.

My prize will sit proudly in my woman cave.

[–] EdibleFriend@lemmy.world 9 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Sorry but lemmy has declared you a male. Your penis will arrive in 3 to 5 business days.

[–] girlfreddy@sh.itjust.works 7 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I have a battery-operated one that gives me no drama or grief.

Hopefully that penis is returnable.

[–] EdibleFriend@lemmy.world 7 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Best I can do is store credit.

[–] humorlessrepost@lemmy.world 1 points 1 year ago

If she really cared about her battery-operated penis, she’d use the store credit to buy it a fleshlight.

[–] TigrisMorte@kbin.social 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Please note; man was intended as species as in "give that dog a prize" I'm just a dead cat.

[–] girlfreddy@sh.itjust.works 1 points 1 year ago
[–] Socsa@sh.itjust.works 11 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Most places that are not Texas still have something resembling the old school utility model where the state effectively grants a license to a private company to operate and manage the grid, which is itself a public right of way. This is governed by a state appointed utility board.

[–] Reverendender@sh.itjust.works 4 points 1 year ago

And in RI, when everyone objects loudly, they nod their heads, and then do it anyway.

[–] YoHuckleberry@lemmy.world 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Can you point me to where I might learn more about this?

[–] A_Random_Idiot@lemmy.world 71 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Yep. Essential services should not be for profit.

[–] hobbicus@lemmy.world 3 points 1 year ago (2 children)

For profit isn’t inherently a bad thing, but the more essential the service should warrant more and more regulations on safety security and pricing. They should not be given unlimited control over these.

Government agencies are more than capable of providing equally shitty service even without a profit motive, see: DMV. Any monopoly is. This is partially why regarding universal healthcare most people aren’t advocating for government owned healthcare facilities, but the government being the single payer to privately run facilities to control prices.

[–] Instigate@aussie.zone 8 points 1 year ago

While government monopolies can absolutely create shitty services, the main difference between a government service and privately-controlled service is that the government (and hence, the people, in a democracy) has the power to direct the service on how to operate. The government can’t just shut down a private power supplier because their customer service is trash, and the individual consumer has no power as to how the service operates.

[–] A_Random_Idiot@lemmy.world 3 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

I assume the DMV being shitty is just a meme, like Taco Bell giving you diarrhea.

cause i've been in many DMVs, in several states, and never had a headache with it, and no one I know personally has had a problem either. Small sample base, of course.

[–] linearchaos@lemmy.world 10 points 1 year ago (1 children)

No no... Checks the GOP playbook: we just need to offer a premium power support plan so if the power goes out they'll provide you a backup generator. It just costs twice the normal rate.

[–] NotMyOldRedditName@lemmy.world 4 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

I know your joking here, but this is actually the path forward and is being implemented in other states and countries.

The power company provides at a discount or for free a home backup battery to the residence. If not free, You pay off the battery at a very affordable rate but end up with a smaller power bill as the power company can access its power to balance the load, filling it up when power is cheap and the battery being used when power is expensive.

In a blackout, the home owner gets to use the battery and doesn't suffer an outage.

It makes the grid more secure by dispersing it around thousands of homes instead of a large expensive failure points and gives them an improved ability to balance the overall load instead of needing a gas peaker plant.

I think it was recently announced that a Vermont power company was going to onboard 100% of their users in the next few years, but it's happening elsewhere too. If a tree takes something down in a snow storm, people won't lose power giving them time to fix it.

[–] JoeBigelow@lemmy.ca 5 points 1 year ago (2 children)

That actually seems like a really good idea on the infrastructure side. We should still get rid of private power companies.

We should still get rid of private power companies.

Absolutely.

[–] linearchaos@lemmy.world 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Batteries are consumable though. Only so much usage available

[–] NotMyOldRedditName@lemmy.world 6 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

An LFP battery will last over a decade of daily full discharges, and that's not going to be what happens, and even then, it's still 80%.

Probably looking at ~~30-40~~ 20-30 years before wanting to replace it due to energy levels.

Peaker plants also require maintenance and staffing and other costs associated with them.

The batteries being consumable isn't a problem.

Edit: and gas from a peaker plant is consumed too

[–] jasondj@ttrpg.network 10 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (2 children)

That’s communism and we are a capitalist country.

The right thing to do under a capitalist economy is to buy the government and give yourself a monopoly.

This isn’t a natural monopoly, it’s protected by legislature and cronyism.

A proper capitalist approach to utilities, then the pipes and wires need to be considered no different then the road they are installed on. Recoup money by selling metered wholesale access to the carriers and utilities.

But we don’t have proper capitalism. We have this bastardized American version that sucks.

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

We settled it before the damn constitution even started. How these nitwits in DC don’t see how publicly run infrastructure doesn’t provide for the common defense or promote general welfare is beyond me. But I guess running water, heat, affordable healthcare, and an ability to communicate with each other and the rest of the world doesn’t count under that, somehow.

Maybe if the courts took the founders intent from the Prologue instead of the secret letters to their mistresses, we’d have a functional system. But that’s just my opinion.

[–] otp@sh.itjust.works 16 points 1 year ago (1 children)

A government providing services is not communism, it's a first-world standard.

[–] jasondj@ttrpg.network 7 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

I thought the sarcasm of my first two paragraphs was heavily laid on, but I suppose not.

I don’t disagree with you, however the majority of electoral college and senate voters agree with my first two paragraphs.

We are insistent that we must do things differently. This American Exceptionalism, as if there’s something fundamentally different between humans born inside its walls than the ones born out.

If we must be insistent that we’re different, we should at least be consistent in its application. The preamble basically implies that the ideal is exactly what you and the rest of my post is saying.

In the modern world a countries greatest strength is its ability to utilize its economies of scale. If for no other reason we should at least realize that the existing systems are unsustainably wasteful.

[–] otp@sh.itjust.works 4 points 1 year ago

I'm sorry. I had someone argue something very similar to me. And since it was someone I knew IRL, I knew they were 100% serious...

[–] Illuminostro@lemmy.world 4 points 1 year ago (1 children)

You mean the dudes who owned slaves and thought that only white men were people? Ok yeah, they were righteous ...

[–] jasondj@ttrpg.network 0 points 1 year ago

Many of them were either abolitionists or manumissionists. It’s hard to believe we had always been so conflicted since our founding (as many of the northern states had already abolished slavery before ratifying the constitution), yet still managed to have a reasonably functional government essentially made up entirely of rich white dudes who openly hated each others guts.

Also it’s easy to sit here and poo-poo the whole slavery thing now, 300 something years later. Washington got his first slaves from inheritance. When he was 11. That’s not me dismissing it, that’s just me demonstrating how normalized it was.

[–] SCB@lemmy.world 9 points 1 year ago (2 children)

The issue here is specifically that they're not monopolies any more, because of deregulation

Ironically, if they were a monopoly, they would have an obligation to provide power in emergencies, per the ruling.

[–] NotMyOldRedditName@lemmy.world 3 points 1 year ago (1 children)

So this is more like the spiderman pointing at spiderman thing.

[–] deadbeef79000@lemmy.nz 2 points 1 year ago

Except instead of Spiderman it's the Monopoly Man.

[–] WHYAREWEALLCAPS@kbin.social 2 points 1 year ago

I believe cartel would be a better name for it in this case. ERCOT is a cartel.

[–] thedridge@lemmy.world 6 points 1 year ago

Why did it take me so long to finally realize that by privatizing services like these, governments are preemptively shifting the blame when the service fails? Voters who are angry at the energy company won't be (as) angry with the politicians.

[–] a9249@lemmy.world 5 points 1 year ago

What are yah, some sorta communist? /s He's sayin private companies shouldnt be fuckin us over, get him! /s

[–] oce@jlai.lu -1 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Production can be liberalised, but it requires good regulation. Regulation failed to include a rule for responsibility to provided a minimum of energy, the judge can't do more than the regulation law. It works in EU, we didn't have blackout past year even though the situation was dramatic mostly due to the Russian invasion, because the liberalised market allowed efficient sharing of energy where it was most needed.
I wouldn't be so certain a public monopoly could have managed it in such an efficient way (in terms of finance, energy usage and service). People tend to idealize public administration.