Can’t speak for other countries, but in China we had very bad experiences with the Trotskyists (Chen Duxiu faction). The Stalinist/Comintern faction (Wang Ming) was also problematic, and Mao gave Stalin a 70/30 assessment, but with the Trotskyists, he completely trashed it. (There is a reason why Mao is so revered in China, for he succeeded in synthesizing the correct path for Chinese socialism, which could have easily ended in disaster had it gone down either of the other two paths)

The Chinese Trotskyists condemned any sort of collaboration with the KMT nationalists when Japan was literally invading at the doorsteps. For them, it is better for China to be colonized by Japan if that meant it could arouse workers solidarity across all the countries that are being colonized by the imperialists.

Trotskyists believe that international workers solidarity is the most important part of socialism, and strictly condemn any sort of collaboration with right wing nationalists, even when the country is under threat of fascist invasion. Mao wrote scathing remarks regarding such views in his essay on the role of communists in national wars, arguing that nationalism (in the third world sense, not in the European national chauvinist sense) is an integral part of internationalism and you cannot have internationalism without nationalism.

Note: to be fair to Chen Duxiu, he did eventually come to correctly identify the nationalist struggle as the principal contradiction for China at the time, and did renounce Trotskyism, but his tainted reputation would not be restored until the 1990s.

[–] aaaaaaadjsf@hexbear.net 15 points 1 year ago

With regards to Mao and Trotskyists, the big problem post WW2 is that Mao's "New Democracy" policies were in direct contradiction with Trotsky's theory of permanent revolution.

[–] star_wraith@hexbear.net 11 points 1 year ago

You mention how the Trots in China failed to identify the primary contradiction. In 2023, I feel like they make the same mistake. The principal contradiction right now is the one between imperialist and anti-imperialist spheres. And by going against China and other AES states and supporting the line of the imperialist powers, they are repeating the same mistakes (at least this seems to be the majority of Trots, seems like there are plenty that do not think this way).

[–] TonyToniToneOfficial@lemmy.ml 10 points 1 year ago (2 children)

I have always wondered why Mao didn't join with Stalin and form a single country, and reading your comment has helped me understand the situation better. Thank you for this.

[–] JK1348@hexbear.net 7 points 1 year ago

One can dream

[–] Vncredleader@hexbear.net 7 points 1 year ago

That would be an insanely bad move. Parts of China had been under hostile rule for decades or longer, and the revolution succeeded at all due to the nationalist movement. Merging with the USSR would feel like subjugation, it would take the victory against Japan, and the victory over the Manchu dominated Qing, and just throw it out as far as the majority of people would be concerned.

Mao and Stalin also differ greatly on the National Question and Mao was cognizant of the fact that there was no merging without being told to deport a hell of a lot of people. Heck Chinese in the Soviet Union had been deported almost entirely in the late 1920s-early 1930s. Including Chinese volunteers who fought for the Bolsheviks and along side the deportations of Korean volunteers because the Soviets said Japan could use their existence as pretext for expanding an ethnic or linguistic border.

They would be on edge waiting for orders to start coming saying to create more homogenized regions, and the removal and relocation of nationalities deemed "unloyal" which would also not be good for the Soviets because Xinjiang already had been Soviet aligned and during that process in the early 20s Central Asian rebels fled there and caused fears of incursions.

Plus the Soviets wanted a buffer. There is a reason they repeatedly rejected Mongolia's requests to become an SSR.

[–] Dolores@hexbear.net 9 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Trotskyists believe that international workers solidarity is the most important part of socialism, and strictly condemn any sort of collaboration with right wing

i don't think this is strictly true. the POUM worked with the Popular Front in Spain, which included the Liberals

[–] Mardoniush@hexbear.net 8 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

The POUM like the rest of the "International Marxist Centre was disavowed by Trotsky for this and other takes (most notably calling for dentante between ML, Councilist, Leftcom, and Trot groups.)

[–] Vncredleader@hexbear.net 4 points 1 year ago

The Duxiu and Ming blocs fighting with the majority of the revolution is such a strange time to read about. So many demands that just utterly missed the material conditions in China and the needs of the revolution