this post was submitted on 01 Sep 2023
62 points (97.0% liked)

Meta (slrpnk.net)

602 readers
5 users here now

Here we can discuss anything about this Lemmy instance/server itself.

Our XMPP support chat: Movim or XMPP client.

Please also refer to our Wiki

founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
 

As a matter of community building, lets make this a monthly thing 😊

Community gardening

As stated in our Wiki, we allow members to create their own communities as a way to encourage contributions, but this comes with the responsibility of active moderation. The site admins can't moderate all communities and unless a posts gets reported, they might not even know about spam etc. Thus we will regularly prune seemingly abandoned communities.

The current list set for pruning is:

So unless someone wants to step up and take them over for moderation and active contribution, they will be removed at the end of the month.

In addition there are these two communities that attract quite a bit of moderation workload and the current mods need support with that (otherwise it might be better to prune them as well):

Technical updates

The originally planned move to a smaller dedicated server was only partially completed and ran into some issue with 8GB RAM being slightly too small for our current Lemmy database use. It might be just a a memory leak issue that should be fixed with the next Lemmy release, but given some related consideration I decided to try use another server with 16GB RAM instead. This move has not been started yet, but I will try to keep the down-time to a minimum.

This server also has a built in GPU that would likely allow automatic scanning for illegal images via Lemmy-safty. This image recognition script is fully local, so no data is transmitted to any 3rd party, but it will likely result in some false-positives (Likely NSFW / child themed ones, which seems not like a major problem for our instance). Any hits will be removed from the storage automatically so this will also protect our moderators from having to deal with such potentially traumatic imagery.

I also made some progress with the account integration between Lemmy and an XMPP/Jabber server. The idea is that you will be able to use your existing username@slrpnk.net ID also for federated chat via the Jabber network. This is more secure than the internal Lemmy DMs as Jabber clients support end to end encryption (like Signal more or less). If in the future some Lemmy clients will add privacy preserving UnifiedPush we can also support that via this XMPP server.

I also started trialling a Movim web-client for it, which besides being a nice chat interface for private 1:1 and group chats, can also act as a long-form blogging site (kinda like Medium or Substack) for our members. Lets see if there is an interest in that 🤔

In theory bridges to Matrix, Discord, Telegram etc. could also be added, but it will need some more testing and might not work out. Voice and video calls will also initially not be supported due to some technical issue, but I plan to fix that ASAP.

Draft code of conduct

I am also still looking for feedback on and maybe some contributions to our incomplete draft code of conduct.

Open discussion

If you have any other topics related to our community here on slrpnk.net please comment below.

you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] Aksamit@slrpnk.net 5 points 1 year ago (2 children)

There's a fine line between avoiding 'doomer talk' and actively lying about the state of reality.

I'm all for hope (I desperately want to have it) but I'm really struggling with all the posts here that massively minimise the danger we're in and promote wishful thinking.

I don't know how this can be changed or improved upon but vehemently pretending that protesting, signing petitions, and setting up community gardens is enough, is just making me uncomfortable.

How do we lift each other up and make tomorrow a better place when all the science points to climate collapse and fresh water and arable land being depleted in the next 5 to 30 years?

[–] hazeebabee@slrpnk.net 7 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

I think its about where the focus is. There was a really good discussion on it last week. I agree it is a fine line to walk. We dont want to be blindly positive, nor do we want to be hopelessly negative. I think part of it is being okay with imperfect or partial solutions. Perfection is the enemy of the good, and people who only hear about how awful everything is tend to tune things out or quit trying.

I think what most people want is to be realistically aware of where the world is without being so overwhelmed they stop trying. I agree petitions and community gardens wont fix the world, but I do thing they are still a positive step in the right direction. We want to recognize and encourage actions like that. Its not all that needs to be done, but it is still nice that it is happening.

Avoiding doomer talk doesnt mean only agreeing, nor does it mean avoiding hard topics. I think it is about maintaining some hope that we can make things even a little bit better, and celebrating those moments even when they are small.

Example of being a doomer: Going onto a post of someone sharing a community garden they started just to rant about how gardens dont make a sizable impact on global emmissions & how it is privilaged and wasteful since the garden isnt even planted according to permaculture principles.

Example of being an encourager: going onto a post of someone sharing a community garden they just started and complimenting their work, recommending some native plants they could consider for next year, and linking to additional steps people could take (like starting a compost, giving out free seeds and seedlings to other people in the neighborhood, replacing grass with other vegitation, etc)

Doomer: electric cars are terrible, we still need to mine the minerals, and the whole car centric focus is problematic >:/

Encourager: congrats on the hybrid that will cut done on emmissions for sure! i notice youre in Vancouver. They actually have a petition to set aside money to convert some roadways into solar powered trains. If youre interested come the the city cousil meeting this sat it would be great if you could come show your support!

One final thought: the c/collapse community was originally created as a space for people who are feeling a but doomed to talk about those feelings, vent, and work together to move towards a healthier mindset. So avoiding doomer talk isnt about burying those feelings, i think its more about being mindful of where and how we vent those feelings of doom & the impact those feelings can have on others.

[–] ProdigalFrog@slrpnk.net 6 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

How do we lift each other up and make tomorrow a better place when all the science points to climate collapse and fresh water and arable land being depleted in the next 5 to 30 years?

By depleted, do you mean completely gone, or beginning to decline? If it's the former, could you link the study which points to that happening in 5 to 30 years? I ask only because the more dire estimates I've seen seem to suggest things will certainly be A LOT worse, but not uninhabitable globally.

[–] Aksamit@slrpnk.net 3 points 1 year ago (1 children)
[–] ProdigalFrog@slrpnk.net 3 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

Alright so I did a minor deep dive on this, and this is my tl;dr conclusion so far:

Both of those links make claims by individuals (granted they're part of the UN, but still) without citing any studies to back them up, and the studies I did find on those subjects make me question the legitimacy of their claims.

Longer version:

  1. The first link in which Csaba Kőrösi claims that water demand will be 40% higher than capacity by 2030 is somewhat suspect, as This article about how NASA says we're running out of water references This Study that claims we currently have no way of accurately measuring the total amount of ground water.

So it seems we can detect if we're drawing too much water to the point of it not being able to fill back up, but we do not know how much is there.

If it is true that we cannot accurately measure the total amount of freshwater, how can he claim to know that exact percentage of over capacity, and with no studies referenced? It seems pretty odd.

  1. The second link regarding 90% of Topsoil being 'at risk'; Again, no sources or studies cited by the dude making the FAO guy. Looking into it further, Topsoil is certainly being lost, but, at least according to this article: in the Midwest US, it appears that most erosion is due to farming practices, not climate change itself, and it could be mostly remedied by No-Till or minimal tilling farming practices, which compared to solving other climate problems, is relatively easily done.

While there is no doubt that we ARE using too much fresh water, and we ARE losing topsoil, I do not believe certain doom is imminent. But if you can find the sources they were basing their claims on, I will stand corrected.

[–] Aksamit@slrpnk.net 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

The answer to your first point is going to be maths and the water cycle.

You proved the second point. We should do day trips to industrial agricultural properties to teach them.about the wonders of no till farming practices. I'm sure they'll love it, even if it isn't as profitable!

I'll find you some 'better sources' tonight when I get home as it's 7am here right now and I'm writing this while brushing my teeth.

[–] ProdigalFrog@slrpnk.net 4 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

The answer to your first point is going to be maths and the water cycle.

I read more of the study I linked to, which actually seems to support the first claim you linked to, at least partially. Essentially, almost all groundwater capacity estimates are based on deeply flawed assumptions that were criticized in the 90's. These old estimates over estimate by orders of magnitude the amount of water available.

The study says that it is possible to acquire accurate measurements of total storage capacity with direct measurement using a particular system, but so far that has not generally been done, so we still don't have truly accurate measurements, but the old ones are definitely overestimating what highly agricultural/industrial areas have (it mentions that in places that did not have an agrarian revolution, like Africa, the amount of groundwater is quite stable, and is not in danger of being depleted.

So...Yeah that actually paints a pretty dire situation, and my shallow deep dive conclusion of that was wrong. But as there really doesn't seem to be enough data, it doesn't seem possible to give an exact estimate of 40% overcapacity.

I’m sure they’ll love it, even if it isn’t as profitable!

While No-till definitely seems to not be as profitable until 10 years of application, in the minimal tilling article one of the options is Strip tilling, which gives comparable yields to traditional tilling while keeping most of the benefits of No-till:

In one study, yields were higher in the strip-tilled area than in the area where no-till was practiced. In a low phosphorus site, yield was 43.5 bushels/acre (2,925.5 kg/hectare) in strip-till compared to 41.5 bu/a (2,791 kg/ha) in a no-till system.[7] Yield is comparable to that of intensive tillage systems — without the cost.

It does have some disadvantages compared to traditional tilling, but none that are showstoppers. Would farmers willingly adopt this new technique on mass of their own volition for the sake of the soil itself? Probably not. As the topsoil article I linked to mentioned, the only reason agricultural media sources started reporting on NASA's study at all is because it estimated how much money the topsoil erosion would cost the farmers per year. Maybe if they feel their livelihood is truly at risk, they may be more willing to adopt these new methods.

Alternatively, these new methods could be legally mandated, or subsidized (Pay the farmers to use the new methods), just like the government did to combat the dust bowl.

Though the part below that in the article isn't super promising...

Patrick Allitt recounts how fellow historian Donald Worster responded to his return visit to the Dust Bowl in the mid-1970s when he revisited some of the worst afflicted counties:

Capital-intensive agribusiness had transformed the scene; deep wells into the aquifer, intensive irrigation, the use of artificial pesticides and fertilizers, and giant harvesters were creating immense crops year after year whether it rained or not. According to the farmers he interviewed, technology had provided the perfect answer to old troubles, such of the bad days would not return. In Worster's view, by contrast, the scene demonstrated that America's capitalist high-tech farmers had learned nothing. They were continuing to work in an unsustainable way, devoting far cheaper subsidized energy to growing food than the energy could give back to its ultimate consumers.

I guess the only difference now is that they won't have any other options but to try other methods once the ground water is used up and their yields are reduced from lack of viable topsoil.

I’ll find you some ‘better sources’ tonight

I realized just now that when referencing the second link, I said "Again, no sources or studies cited, just a claim." which makes it sound like I was directing that at you. Sorry about that, I didn't mean to direct at you, I was referring to the UN FAO making that claim without sources or studies, and edited my comment to make that more clear.

[–] poVoq@slrpnk.net 5 points 1 year ago

The entire argument rests on the assumption that we need to continue with the same or even higher levels of conventional agriculture. There is some truth to it in the sense that it is currently the cheapest form of food production, but just by reducing food waste and animal mass production, a large part of that overconsumption of freshwater and top soil already disappears (if not entirely... one would need to do the math on that).

In addition to that, vastly more efficient food production methods exist that require no or very little top-soil and need only a fraction of the fresh water compared to field irrigation. This isn't miracle technology, it just needs people building the infrastructure for it, which currently isn't done as mining fossil water and depleting top soils is cheaper.