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this post was submitted on 02 Aug 2023
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How about letting people enjoy things? If you don't want to play games or have access to the biggest gaming library there is currently, then it's fine, won't blame you. People have the freedom to decide if they want to limit their privacy a bit (while things stated on that website like credit card, address, browsing history, chat logs and forum posts are like: no shit, they sell games, have an internal browser and chats and forums, of course they do that. And with that defenition, you are currently as well on a spyware platform, because your posts are saved unencrypted on your homeserver) to have access to their games where some have invested A LOT of money in, before knowing about such things.
And before you say: but it is open source!: Doesn't hold the administrators back from still selling your data using software analyzing the database. And to give more examples what would be spyware with their definition:
Talking about lemmy, easy to miss the transition
Yes, sorry, wasn't well written.
Reading comprehension required
"and with that definition, the platform you are currently as well on a spyware platform... " "And before you say: but it is open source!: Doesn’t hold..."
How is this person's criticism preventing you from enjoying things?
The criticism itself is not. Throwing assumptions like "you are an addict if you continue to use this platform no matter what your reason is" (which is what I read out of this person's comment) around is also not preventing anyone from enjoying things. I just thought that specifically this assumption was overshot and it read like a straight up insult. I do get it now at least a bit although especially because they just insulted me without any arguments, I still guess that they just insulted people and not gave them a diagnosis of an addiction.
Oh, that person was definitely insulting people and accusing them of addiction, and it wasn't cool at all. I just think the whole "let people enjoy things" retort is ridiculous and overdone.
Yeah ok, I understand that.
I do go with you, that nobody is stopping them using it. I was just pissed from the statement of the author of the comment, saying, if you don't stop using it, you are just an addict. That is simply not true, because of the bullshit DRM, one is bound to the platform. I aswell try to get away from DRM as much as possible but I of course reject ditching Steam completely. I won't throw away all the games I bought just to get rid of "spyware" or rather not-perfectly-privacy-friendly-marketplace-software using the horror DRM is.
Which one(s)? Very interested to know if Valve is breaking the law by operating their digital storefront.
Rights are not a purely legal concept. You can have rights that are not codified by law.
Sure, but in that case it should absolutely be specified what type of "right" we're referring to. I'm guessing this falls in category of moral rights? They're breaking our moral rights by operating the same way each other digital storefront does.
More clarification would be helpful, I agree.
I'm not sure if I'm understanding you correctly, but "everyone else is doing evil too" is not an incredibly effective defense against doing evil.
I'm not defending their activities; I was looking for clarification on what the OP was claiming. My last sentence summary is essentially that.
I see. My apologies for misunderstanding you.
All good. Just wanted to add that its nice we can have this convo without insulting eachother lol.
That has nothing to do with the multiple different meanings of the word "rights". Plus anyone spending any significant amount of time in a legal field is going to have a much different interpretation than what you're implying here. That's why I said you should have been explicit with what you meant.
Sure, I get that, but as I said, if you already "own" quite some amount of games on steam I think it's reasonable to not have your money completely wasted by refusing to use steam at all. Social bindings are an "issue" as well. If the multiplayer game you want to play with your friends is for some reason bound to steam, then many will choose their friends over their privacy. And I think we all know how hard it is to get others away from their comfort zone. Same with the debate to get rid of Discord.
Huh, didn't know that there are workarounds for some games to get rid of DRM. Good to know.
Steam pushed gambling down their throat with lootboxes. They now have to play and win prizes or their dopamine hits the floor
You have the absolute freedom to be stupid and i have the absolute freedom to call you an idiot
Hey, try being kind. No need to start name-calling, no matter how much you disagree with this person about their personal choice to use a platform.
What do you think it's worst: being called an idiot in the middle discussion or having all your data mined maliciously and sold to third parties and having your kids abducted into gambling?
Why not neither? Why don't you be kind AND avoid steam? If your motive is as morally driven as you seem to imply, then I'm sure you would have a much higher success rate at converting people to your cause if you didn't call them names.
To be stupid is not a slur it's also a fact. If you smoke cigarettes to look cool knowing they are bad for you, you are stupid. If you use steam and everyone keeps telling you that it's bad but you overlook it and don't want to understand, you are stupid.
Okay cool thanks.
If your motive is as morally driven as you seem to imply, then I’m sure you would have a much higher success rate at converting people to your cause if you didn’t call them names. So why not be kind? Do you gain anything at all by calling someone stupid? Does it make them more likely to stop using steam? Does it reduce the amount of data Valve collect from users? Does it just make you feel smart?
I just tell people the truth
Right so calling people stupid is more important to you than getting people to stop using Steam. Got it.
You have the absolute freedom to choose this strange hill to die on, and people have the absolute freedom to call you an idiot for doing so. But it wouldn't be constructive or serve any purpose, so I don't imagine anyone would find it worth doing.
Ok so first of all, "everyone" is restricted to you and stappern. Now what's the difference between you two? Stappern made actual good and valid points and got me convinced a bit more to stay away from steam as much as it is possible for me in my situation without even insulting me once. If you really think you could get others convinced of your opinion by just insulting them, then I think it would be cool for you to call you stupid.
And that the comparison between doing something that reduces your lifetime and overall quality of live vs. giving others the data they need to stay in compliance with the various legal systems and get you the things you bought WITH money (because you seem to also understand downloading foss software as buying), is so farfetched that it's even crazy to come up with, should be clear.
Sad that you don't even try to defend your view but rather resort to straight up insult me instead. That's how we discuss in the internet nowadays.
Sad that you can't understand someone making a point
Ok so this will be the last comment on this thread, I just want to make one final thing clear and I suggest that we get out of our way afterwards.
I totally understand, that selling data to third parties is a bad thing, but even your cited site doesn't claim, that valve sells one's private data to third parties and their privacy policy also doesn't state it (at least the german version I have read through), even more they explicitly state in 5. that they don't sell data to third parties. They only state that they give it to third parties where they more or less have to.
Now one has to decide if they trust valve to hold on their own PP but that is always the case for every platform, even open source ones,because again, no one can easily verify, that they don't do shady business with your data, because they won't give you ssh access for obvious reasons.
Don't get me wrong, I am pretty paranoid as well: I don't use any Microsoft products anymore (except minecraft), I stay away from Meta and Google as well by using e.g. signal and matrix for communication and have lineage on my phone, I use noscript because I don't trust every website's JavaScript and host my own instances for gaming servers, git and other stuff on my netcup server.
But I step out at some point where convenience wins over more privacy and security. I don't package and compile everything myself, have verified the souce code before myself, because I trust the maintainers. I don't have a completely open hardware PC, where I have built and verified everything myself, because I trust chosen manufacturers that they haven't tampered with it (and don't have the time or even money to do that).
Technically we have the absolute freedom to call you an idiot too though. Nobody has to care about what you think matters.