this post was submitted on 07 Jul 2024
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No Stupid Questions

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The theory, which I probably misunderstand because I have a similar level of education to a macaque, states that because a simulated world would eventually develop to the point where it creates its own simulations, it's then just a matter of probability that we are in a simulation. That is, if there's one real world, and a zillion simulated ones, it's more likely that we're in a simulated world. That's probably an oversimplification, but it's the gist I got from listening to people talk about the theory.

But if the real world sets up a simulated world which more or less perfectly simulates itself, the processing required to create a mirror sim-within-a-sim would need at least twice that much power/resources, no? How could the infinitely recursive simulations even begin to be set up unless more and more hardware is constantly being added by the real meat people to its initial simulation? It would be like that cartoon (or was it a silent movie?) of a guy laying down train track struts while sitting on the cowcatcher of a moving train. Except in this case the train would be moving at close to the speed of light.

Doesn't this fact alone disprove the entire hypothesis? If I set up a 1:1 simulation of our universe, then just sit back and watch, any attempts by my simulant people to create something that would exhaust all of my hardware would just... not work? Blue screen? Crash the system? Crunching the numbers of a 1:1 sim within a 1:1 sim would not be physically possible for a processor that can just about handle the first simulation. The simulation's own simulated processors would still need to have their processing done by Meat World, you're essentially just passing the CPU-buck backwards like it's a rugby ball until it lands in the lap of the real world.

And this is just if the simulated people create ONE simulation. If 10 people in that one world decide to set up similar simulations simultaneously, the hardware for the entire sim reality would be toast overnight.

What am I not getting about this?

Cheers!

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[–] MrJameGumb@lemmy.world 2 points 4 months ago

I understand the point your making, but what if the simulation was actually not shared at all?

Perhaps in this scenario the human brain is the only required hardware? Then there would only be one "base simulation" that is in fact just a basic set of prompts, rules, and initial visual stimulus that is then sent to each person in essence creating a whole separate simulation within each individual. Everything that happens after that is created based on how each individual reacts to the initial prompts. The main system would not have to create any new data to keep the simulation growing because the human mind would create and store all new information within itself. Each new person born would have all the additional hard drive and processing power needed to keep the simulation going for the rest of their lives.

Just consider that if the world as we know it is just a simulation, and that simulation is all we have ever known since birth, how would you ever know if the other people are real or not? Would it even matter?

[–] lath@lemmy.world 2 points 4 months ago

It's light-based computing.

So you make a framework, compound it into a big bang ball and then let it run. Afterwards, you analyze the imagery from start to finish or at whatever point you need to.

Can't interact with it though, only observe.

[–] PhlubbaDubba@lemm.ee 1 points 4 months ago (8 children)

Simple answer, our sim is an entire universe, so likely it's being run on a jupiter brain or matrioshka brain.

It could even be possible to run it on a Black Hole computer.

Basically all these options would allow well beyond the computing power needed to not just simulate a universe, but to handle individual people in that universe also running simulations.

In fact it may even be optimized for that to allow scientists to run simulations within the simulated universe for the purpose of experiments that need simulation but don't require an entire ulta-massive black hole's worth of computing power to get the results needed.

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[–] WolfLink@sh.itjust.works 1 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

You’ve basically hit the nail on the head. It’s pretty simple to argue based on information theory / statistical mechanics that a machine that runs the simulation has to support at least as many states as the thing its simulating, so a machine that simulates a universe as complex as its host would take up the entire host universe.

It’s a fun idea but ultimately it’s not at all scientific and shouldn’t be taken seriously.

[–] LoreleiSankTheShip@lemmy.ml 1 points 4 months ago

Very simple. I'm the only one being simulated, all of you people are AIs. /s

I seem to remember that the common concensus is that it would be easier to create a whole universe than the individual simulation model.

[–] mjhelto@lemm.ee 0 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago)

Why do you think everything sucks right now? The simulations ran out of resources long ago so no new ideas are created, just rehashing of already established ones. It's why we have AI, but it can't generate anything new or useful. It's why we're about to have a restart of World War 2 and The Cold War. It's why movies that come out already are getting remade, but slightly worse than the original story.

People like to think that's because capitalism only caters to the safe bets. But we know better! It's really just that the old Apple 2e that's running the simulation(s) is low on resources!!

Now, where did I leave all that red string, pictures of Bigfoot and the Loc Ness monster, and thumbtacks?

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