this post was submitted on 10 Aug 2023
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U.S. Senator Joe Manchin, a maverick Democrat who has often bucked party leadership, told a radio station in his home state of West Virginia on Thursday that he is "thinking seriously" about leaving the party.

"I'm not a Washington Democrat," Manchin said in the interview on Talkline with Hoppy Kercheval, a West Virginia Metro News show. "I've been thinking seriously about that (becoming an independent) for quite some time."

Manchin and Democratic-turned-independent colleague Senator Kyrsten Sinema have been thorns in top Senate Democrat Chuck Schumer's side since the party won its majority in 2020. Democrats hold a 51-49 majority, including three independents who caucus with them.

Last month Manchin further stirred Democratic concerns with an appearance in the early-voting state of New Hampshire with the "No Labels" group, where he mulled starting a third-party presidential campaign in 2024, challenging Democratic President Joe Biden. Having a third-party candidate would "threaten" the two major political parties, Manchin said.

Manchin has used his influence to block legislation that he opposes - including expanding voting rights protections and child tax credits - and to ensure passage of bills he supports, such as a major tax and climate law that passed last summer.

He faces a tough re-election bid next year in Republican-leaning West Virginia, which former President Donald Trump won by almost 39 percentage points in 2020. Manchin has not yet said if he will seek re-election, but he would face an even steeper road if he spurned his party and the fundraising support it can provide.

West Virginia Governor Jim Justice, a former Democrat-turned Republican, began his campaign in April for the Republican nomination to seek Manchin's seat.

Manchin, a popular former governor who was first elected to the U.S. Senate in 2010, has kept his seat in part by maintaining a reputation as a rare conservative Democrat in Washington.

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[–] Karzyn@beehaw.org 58 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (6 children)

Many comments here are complaining about Manchin without taking the time to consider the political acrobatics necessary to win a statewide office in West Virginia as a Democrat. Yes, he's been a pain in the ass but a Republican in that seat would be much, much worse. If nothing else, he's a point towards control of the chamber. Sinema is a different story because she ran as being more progressive than she ended up being and because Kelly is proof positive that an actual Democrat could have won on Arizona. Manchin has never shied away from what he stands for and is probably the only person who could keep the seat blue. So yeah, hate his politics all you want but recognize that him leaving the party would be a terrible thing.

[–] acastcandream@beehaw.org 20 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I live in a very red state and I feel like people just don’t understand how bad the alternative is. I’d take Manchin over my GOP senators.

[–] bluegreenzeros@beehaw.org 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

IMO the difference between Manchin and MOST GOP Congress members is that since he's wearing a blue tie, he's allowed to do things that are commonly believed, but against the GOP groupthink. Outside of the "freedom" caucus and the political stunts and cultural war red herrings, I'd reckon Manchin agrees with more Republicans than Democrats.

[–] acastcandream@beehaw.org 6 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (4 children)

It’s all publicly available info, and you’re actually very incorrect with that guess.

No Republican would vote with the democrats at that rate in either chamber of Congress.

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[–] FlashMobOfOne@beehaw.org 19 points 1 year ago (2 children)

So yeah, hate his politics all you want but recognize that him leaving the party would be a terrible thing.

The reason why things are never going to get better is that 49% of us pretend a Republican's okay because they're wearing a blue suit.

[–] AnarchoYeasty@beehaw.org 7 points 1 year ago (1 children)

That Republican in a blue suit has stopped a lot of terrible decisions and enabled us to make strides in improving our country. We would be a hell of a lot worse off without him.

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[–] FlowVoid@midwest.social 6 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

Manchin consistently votes with Democrats whenever his vote matters.

When his vote doesn't matter, I don't care how he votes or what he says.

[–] Lowbird@beehaw.org 5 points 1 year ago (1 children)

The huge infrastrastructure bill he and Sinema tanked, though.

[–] FlowVoid@midwest.social 5 points 1 year ago

The infrastructure bill was resurrected as the Inflation Reduction Act, which Manchin voted for.

[–] bedrooms@kbin.social 15 points 1 year ago (2 children)

This kind of balanced view is one reason I stay in fediverse and don't go back to Reddit.

[–] gaytswiftfan@beehaw.org 5 points 1 year ago

this take was a top level comment in any thread involving manchin lol

[–] Swallowtail@beehaw.org 3 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I'm a politics junkie and have seen many posts like this on Reddit. If anything I'd say up to now the fediverse has been farther left leaning in my experience.

[–] bedrooms@kbin.social 2 points 1 year ago

Thing is, I'm not talking about left vs right.

[–] middlemuddle@beehaw.org 4 points 1 year ago

Seriously. I get being frustrated with him and wishing for someone better, but that's just not realistic. There are pathways to reduce his power by supporting candidates that can flip a seat in other states, but his seat is only ever likely to get more red.

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[–] theangriestbird@beehaw.org 35 points 1 year ago (2 children)

lol byyyyyye. if he ain't leaving they should kick him out anyway. i know good electoral politics means coalition-building, but i don't see the point in building a coalition with people like Manchin and Sinema who seem to share none of the party's common goals.

[–] BraveSirZaphod@kbin.social 14 points 1 year ago (1 children)

If Manchin didn't exist, not a single piece of Biden's agenda over the past two years would have passed, including things like Justice Jackson joining the Supreme Court.

Yes, he's incredibly annoying, but he's also representing the people of West Virginia, of all places. Would you really prefer a 6-2 Supreme Court? I wouldn't.

[–] FlashMobOfOne@beehaw.org 3 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (3 children)

Assuming you're a wage earner, none of it matters. The Democrats had a supermajority under Obama and all we got for it was more expensive health care, another 500 billion for war every year and a Republican SCOTUS nominee that he didn't even have the balls to fight for.

We have bipartisanship, and it's always there for the worst things. The US spending a trillion-plus dollars a year on war is a permanent thing because of bipartisanship. Abortion is no longer a right because of bipartisanship. You can legally be paid $7 an hour for whatever job you do every day because of bipartisanship.

But they'll make three trillion appear overnight to prop up your investment portfolio, or another trillion appear overnight for a so-called tax cut.

You can pretend someone's better because they're in a blue suit, but 40 years of that thinking is why things are never going to get better in this country.

[–] BraveSirZaphod@kbin.social 9 points 1 year ago

https://www.cbpp.org/research/health/medicaid-expansion-has-saved-at-least-19000-lives-new-research-finds

The Affordable Care Act’s (ACA) expansion of Medicaid to low-income adults is preventing thousands of premature deaths each year, a landmark study finds.[1] It saved the lives of at least 19,200 adults aged 55 to 64 over the four-year period from 2014 to 2017. Conversely, 15,600 older adults died prematurely because of state decisions not to expand Medicaid. (See Figure 1; see Table 1 for state-by-state estimates.) The lifesaving impacts of Medicaid expansion are large: an estimated 39 to 64 percent reduction in annual mortality rates for older adults gaining coverage.

I imagine the several thousand people who are not dead might disagree with the assessment that the ACA (which wasn't a particularly bipartisan endeavor, if you care to check the vote count) did nothing but increase insurance costs.

I don't care enough to respond to the rest of that drivel, and I know you have no interest in facts anyway, but for any readers passing by, there are actual facts that you should look up.

[–] AnarchoYeasty@beehaw.org 8 points 1 year ago (4 children)

Yeah as a type 1 diabetic you can fuck off with that all we got is more expensive healthcare. I never have to be denied because of pre existing conditions thanks to Obama and the democrats. Also we had a super majority for all of 72 days.

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[–] FlowVoid@midwest.social 3 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (3 children)

Democrats had a supermajority for only ten months, and in that time they managed to pass a major piece of legislation on a highly controversial topic.

If you expected more than one in that time frame, then you really don't understand how American politics works.

[–] Dominic@beehaw.org 4 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

It was less than 2 months. Franken wasn’t sworn in until July and Kennedy died in August.

EDIT: it’s actually somewhere in the middle. Kennedy’s seat was held by Kirk, a Democratic appointee, from September through February 2010. However, I am fairly certain that Kennedy was basically unable to serve from March until his death in August.

Democrats basically had late September through early February to get anything done without a filibuster.

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[–] LongbottomLeaf@lemmy.nz 4 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (7 children)

That's what I'm saying. Isn't this the state of Blair Mountain, John Brown's Raid, and October Sky?

Where's the neo Woody Guthrie coal miner's daughter type looking to run a grass roots campaign on justice for the opiate-pushing and transitioning fossil fuel work to sustainable energy? Someone who wants to bring stable, modern jobs to WV and revitalize it while protecting the natural splendor that tourists seek.

He's up for reelection in '24. Someone more sensible should primary this lump of coal. Gotta find that person and build that campaign though. And learn from Beto's mistakes.

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[–] plantstho@beehaw.org 25 points 1 year ago

Tfw you haven't been in the headlines for a while because there's nothing left to obstruct

[–] skellener@kbin.social 16 points 1 year ago

Bye mother-effer! 🖕

[–] glitchead@beehaw.org 12 points 1 year ago

And nothing of value will be lost on that day.

[–] mooncabbage@beehaw.org 11 points 1 year ago

Don't let the door hit you on the way out. Actually, do let it hit you on the way out.

[–] ExoMonk@beehaw.org 10 points 1 year ago

Wait, Joe Manchin is a democrat? /s

[–] Shikadi@beehaw.org 9 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Good, leave so they replace you

[–] AnarchoYeasty@beehaw.org 5 points 1 year ago (3 children)

It's west Virginia. The democrats aren't going to replace him the GOP will.

[–] Shikadi@beehaw.org 2 points 1 year ago
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[–] demonquark@lemmy.ml 9 points 1 year ago
[–] prole@beehaw.org 9 points 1 year ago

Good riddance.

[–] donut4ever@lemm.ee 5 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Oh dude, please don't threaten with a good time. Take that asshole Sinema with you, too, please.

[–] BraveSirZaphod@kbin.social 6 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Oh no, the Dems have now lost the Senate and will be unable to appoint any judges, the importance of which I think has become abundantly clear over the past several years, but at least, for a brief moment, we got a little ideological satisfaction.

[–] donut4ever@lemm.ee 2 points 1 year ago (2 children)

And you think this dude and Sinema would ever help the Dems in any way?

[–] middlemuddle@beehaw.org 12 points 1 year ago

I don't want to just angrily respond to a quip, but have you not been paying any attention at all for the last 2 years? Every big win for Biden, along with countless federal judge positions, have gotten approved through Manchin's involvement. Sinema's, too, unfortunately. Sinema is a liar, deserves no respect, and Arizona would be happy to elect a progressive democrat in her place. But Manchin, as annoying as he is, is probably the best we can expect from West Virginia. Him switching to Independent doesn't mean a GenZ progressive is going to win his seat from him next election, it just means we lose an ally that is helping hold on to a very tenuous "majority" in the Senate. I don't like him, but you cannot discount the fact that he has helped the Democrats a hell of a lot in the last couple years by mostly voting alongside them.

[–] BraveSirZaphod@kbin.social 3 points 1 year ago

Justice Jackson is on the Supreme Court, and would not be if Manchin (or Sinema, for that matter) hadn't approved.

So yes, they have helped the Dems. Not to mention, every significant piece of legislation that passed in the last Congress could have been killed by either of them.

[–] downpunxx@kbin.social 5 points 1 year ago

Republican Joe Manchin wants to make it official. Villain scumbag.

“I’m not a Washington Democrat,” Manchin said in the interview

Fucker's not a Democrat. Well, fake, shitty, whatever pejorative you want to fill in works.

[–] ArugulaZ@kbin.social 4 points 1 year ago

Don't let the door hit you on the way out. After all, that ass is owned by the coal industry, and they don't want it to be bruised.

[–] Bruisedback@kbin.social 4 points 1 year ago

I'm not a political analyst in any capacity and this is pure conjecture, but my gut is telling me that he's getting info that enough West Virginia republicans are willing to vote independent to carry him over the line in the next election. So, walking that out, if republicans are willing to break straight ticket voting to keep a "half-flipped democrat" in office, I think that speaks more to the fracturing of their voting bloc than the acumen of an individual politician who seems to be seeking office for personal gain over party goals. I'm very interested to see how much money is spent on this race this/next year.

[–] ABotelho@lemmy.ca 3 points 1 year ago

Good. Fucking do it.

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