this post was submitted on 05 Jan 2024
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Today I Learned

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[–] KISSmyOS@lemmy.world 63 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (4 children)

It's a nice thought experiment, but absolutely pointless.
Any warning about an unknown-to-us danger that is even just 500 years old or from a different culture is being treated like a superstition by us.

A good example of this would be the Yei River in South Sudan (and other areas along the equator) where the local tribes traditionally didn't settle near the river because the river spirits didn't allow it and brought misfortune and sickness to those who didn't respect them.
Modern settlers disregarded that because it's clearly unscientific, and rivers are great for trade and transportation.
And then the people living near the rivers started going blind, their children suffered from constant seizures and stunted development, and we still don't have a cure.

[–] Carighan@lemmy.world 38 points 10 months ago

Don't you actually make a very good point for this effort?

The problem with the superstitious warning was exactly that it was aimed only at the people of the time. It had no way to preserve it's warning beyond cultural and intellectual changes. Same as the radioactive symbol having too little inherent deterrent in its design so it caused radiation incidents by people who did not know what it means so we designed a new one that's specifically meant to be intuitively "dangerous" to people without any prior knowledge.

So in a similar way, we need to have a way to create warnings about nuclear waste - or a river - that are not limited by the current generation and the way they understand signs and meanings.

[–] Kusimulkku@lemm.ee 20 points 10 months ago

Still worth the effort to try imo.

[–] wildginger@lemmy.myserv.one 11 points 10 months ago

Thats just proof that we have designed systems to pass this knowledge down through time and cultures, and can improve on it to be more resiliant to shifts in culture and time going forward.

[–] awwwyissss@lemm.ee 1 points 10 months ago

Comparing modern civilization to tribes doesn't make sense. We have computers, digital storage, steel, and many other things that will let us preserve and share knowledge in a way humans throughout history probably couldn't even dream of.

[–] FireTower@lemmy.world 26 points 10 months ago (2 children)

YouTube video by Kyle Hill on how we currently store waste for anyone interested. [18:14] https://youtu.be/4aUODXeAM-k?si=

[–] ShaunaTheDead@kbin.social 14 points 10 months ago (1 children)

That's a fantastic video and more people need to watch it!

The biggest take away that people who don't feel like watching should know is that 99% of all nuclear waste actually decays to a completely inert state in 31 years or less. Plus, the amount of nuclear fuel used in every nuclear plant in the entire world since the beginning is a tiny, tiny amount and only about 1% of that will be potentially dangerous longer than 31 years. The 1% of spent fuel that is dangerous long-term could easily be stored in probably just one single deep storage facility where it's stored safely kilometers under the Earth's crust in a geologically stable region forever.

Storage of nuclear waste is a solved problem. The only thing holding the experts back from doing the correct thing with nuclear waste is public perception and unfounded laws forbidding it because of propaganda and scare tactics. There has NEVER been a single incident relating to improper storage of nuclear materials. But there have been loads and loads of incidents involving improper storage of oil, gas, and coal materials.

Nuclear is so, so, SO much safer and cleaner than oil, gas, and coal.

[–] SupraMario@lemmy.world 5 points 10 months ago (1 children)

NIMBYs and coal ash spills... Chernobyl is what caused a ton of this propaganda...

[–] ShaunaTheDead@kbin.social 3 points 10 months ago

Probably a fair bit of pro-oil lobbying as well to get the hippies to protest nuclear for the environment instead of the oil industry.

[–] PipedLinkBot@feddit.rocks 7 points 10 months ago

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[–] ilinamorato@lemmy.world 9 points 10 months ago

The terme d'art for this field of study, in case you want to research more, is "Nuclear Semiotics," and the bulk of the study I've seen about it was undertaken by the WIPP. I personally think it's amazing.

[–] nelly_man@lemmy.world 6 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

The idea here are very interesting to read, but I think I'm leaning most favorably towards the last group's idea to bury it with as little marking as possible. The plans modeled on Stonehenge seem odd to me. Stonehenge is famously a monument whose origin and purpose was a mystery, and that mystery enticed people from all over the world to travel to the site and excavate it. It seems more like a good reference for a method that would not work. How many people would have toyed around at Stonehenge if the monument weren't there?

At the same time, we have events with contaminated materials being used in construction within a matter of months or years, so it's not like these are abstract problems. E.g., look at the 1983 Ciudad Juárez Cobalt 60 incident. We have the technology to identify contaminated materials, but we'd only use them if we have reason to believe we should. It's probably fair to assume the same of future societies, so it makes sense to want to make sure they have reason to believe they should test the area.

[–] Ulvain@sh.itjust.works 0 points 10 months ago (2 children)

Man... Article from 2018 and they still thought we'd eventually have another ice age.. how the times change fast...

[–] jaybone@lemmy.world 7 points 10 months ago

After the nuclear winter we’ll have an ice age.

[–] LazaroFilm@lemmy.world 5 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

In 100,000 years, you very well might be in an ice age period. The global warming trend only took 50 years to appear.