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If you want my opinion: Don't get addicted to nicotine.
I've quit vaping. And it's supposedly easy for some people... But for me, overcoming the nicotine addiction has been hard and just shit and taken way longer than I thought. So, I don't know why you're asking all these questions... Just be a bit cautious with nicotine and things like that.
I stopped vaping last week and holy shit dude the nicotine withdrawals are no joke. I'm absolutely miserable.
I want to express my solidarity. Thank you for sharing. It also makes me feel less alone. Seems it's easier for some people and not so easy for others. I was always told to push through and remind myself it'll get better. Turns out that's not even half the truth. I stopped vaping a few months ago. And I still wouldn't consider myself fine. The worst stuff slowly faded. But it took me way longer than the one or two weeks i read somewhere. It's the right thing, though.
Stay strong, friend, I believe in you 🙏
Thx. Will do.
I’m really sorry to hear that you’re suffering, but I’m curious about what made you decide to quit?
Mostly I just don't want to be a slave to anything.
Thanks for sharing - but why? What is your reason for quitting?
German law. Crazy high taxes were introduced starting earlier this year.
Why do you want to know all the things in your post? They're somewhat specific for 'just curious'. (If I might ask...)
So it’s a monetary thing, mainly? If it was cheap would you still want to quit?
I’m very curious on the topic - having had many friends and relatives who have started vaping, I wanted to get an understanding of the topic, both in terms of health data, but also the perspectives of people who vape.
It’s incredibly difficult to get good, clear information about this - lots of responses are from smokers talking about how much better vaping is than smoking - but we know that kids/teens have been picking up vaping at a high rate without ever having smoked and have been doing so now for a number of years, so those responses aren’t helpful.
On the other hand, when it comes to finding the negatives of vaping, it’s very difficult - so much has been written about one or two overblown stories (e.g. vitamin E acetate in THC vapes, or issues involving black-market or gray-market vapes/nicotine solutions) which absolutely drowns out the ability to find information about the negative health effects of a typical vape user buying name-brand products from reputable suppliers.
Long story short, I’m just trying to gather opinions and personal experience with vaping products. I have no real opinion either way, I’m just looking for the truth.
If you do want to help people avoid nicotine, all of the research has shown that the best anti-smoking campaigns used storytelling and strong emotional messaging - so I would encourage you to share your story if you’ve had a negative experience with vaping.
Edit: I just saw your edit saying my questions were a bit specific, it’s possibly my autism or something that makes me inclined to the way I asked, if that helps. It’s genuinely just curiosity, I’m just weird, haha
I like your curiosity. Smoker turned vaper here. Being addicted to anything rules a part of your mind and life. I crave it constantly. It seriously occupies so much of my time and focus and I don’t really get anything out of it outside of feeding the addiction.
I guess you can say it’s fun but it doesn’t stay fun if you get hooked it’s like a tractor beam.
I’m only talking about my experience with the drug, I realize it’s not this way for others. It’s a powerful drug nonetheless.
Thank you for sharing, this is very insightful.
Alright. It just seemed a bit 'fishy' to me to ask so many specific questions without a hidden motive. And I didn't want to answer someone who is 15 and wants to start vaping because of some coolness factor. But I get your situation. And I like weird people or questions.
Regarding your question about the monetary reasons: E-Liquid prices in Germany increased by something like 20x. Supplies that cost me 15€ last year, now cost like 250€ to 300€. And I vaped a lot. People nowadays buy the stupid disposable vapes from the gas station that only have 2ml of liquid in them. I think my addiction was strong enough that I would have continued vaping indefinitely, if it were not for external factors like this. I can't afford it any more. And I also don't like being addicted to substances, so that's another reason for me to stay strong and pull through now that I've done it.
Let me tell you my insights from what I've experienced and what friends told me:
I think we can all agree that smoking tobacco is stupid. You smell awful (to your partner) everyday. Your lung capacity is affected, nearly every smoker over 30 will tell you they feel it once they do sports. And you'll definitively lose some of your life and die earlier. And you'll waste lots of money for practically nothing in return.
I applaud everyone who quits tobacco and switches to a vape. It does away with most of the downsides of smoking. And it's considerably less harm you're inflicting on yourself.
I think most of the ingredients aren't affecting your body in a way like cigarettes do, for example directly destroying your lungs. The PG and VG (if they're clean) aren't toxic per se. I don't know the studies that tell us if they do anything to your lungs in the long-term. They don't belong there and they probably have some minor effect. Nicotine is toxic but in the little doses we use, little to no hazard to your body. The flavour components probably cause cancer to a certain degree when heated and inhaled. But the hazards of vaping are a joke compared to smoking. (Given the chemicals are okay and clean. People have died because there were other things in their adulterated liquid.) I've had no health effects from vaping for years.
Starting to vape without having smoked prior.... I think it's just silly. You're deliberately making yourself addicted to a nasty substance and altering/interfering with your brain chemistry. Just for shits and giggles. If you absolutely need the coolness factor or are super curious about the thing: Buy something WITHOUT NICOTINE. I (-personal opinion-) think the e-cigarettes or vapes without nicotine are pretty harmless. Lots of things come with a minor cancer risk attached. But they don't change the chemistry in your brain and I think you're perfectly alright using them if you want. It's just not cool. Only a few wasted bucks at the gas station or wherever you buy that e-cigarette. (Mind that behavioral addiction also exists. But I (personally) think without the combination with the substance, it's less of a factor in this particular case.)
Addiction seems to be a super individual thing (my personal experience). My brother switched from vaping something including nicotine to liquid without nicotine, used that for some time when in company with other people and after some time quit entirely and got over it quickly. As far as i know he didn't have major issues quitting the nicotine (substance) or the behaviour. It was easy for him. Another friend told me it took him a bit of effort and a few weeks to get over it but now he's much better and he realized the nicotine in his vape had been interfering with his ADHD all the years before and affecting him negatively. Now, he feels much better. I've been vaping for quite some time. Since quitting I've had all the symptoms of withdrawal. It think I was grumpy for an entire week or two, had headaches. I've been restless and had dizzyness on and off for days on end. And even now, months later I think I'm not 100% over it. I still have cravings sometimes. They've become less. But I think if you gave me something containing nicotine and left me to myself, I'd really need to put in some mental effort not to take it. After listening to advice how to quit smoking, I thought it would have been easier. But it's not. At least not for me. The mental fog and dizzyness have been the worst and most annoying symptoms for me. Quitting didn't change my life around. The only thing is, back then I'd vape every so often and now I don't.
If you ask me, I'd say nicotine is highly addictive and until you know, you probably underestimate it. And you don't know how it affects you until it's too late. You might be one of the people who are less affected by addiction. Or you're one of those who will end up unable to overcome it.
Nicotine feels nice. It makes you a bit dizzy or tingly and you can feel a buzz running through your brain. Especially once your smoking cigarettes. It'll be a small rush and come almost instantly and make you feel good for a moment. It's a bit less and not instant with vaping, but it definitely makes you feel nice and feels like a boost. Best thing is you can reward yourself everytime you want. Just light a cigarette or inhale nicotine from your vape. (And it'll alleviate the withdrawal symptoms you wouldn't feel if you didn't take it in the first place.) Only thing is: You're interfering with your brain chemistry. It has severe consequences. And you don't need it. A normal brain can feel pleasure, an adrenaline rush, have the good hormones released after you achieve something. If you're on nicotine, you'll always also want that short, artificial release of pleasure, too. The one you can give to yourself easily. But that's one of the things that keeps you addicted to the stuff.
Someone who doesn't know that feeling probably wonders and wants to experience it for themselves. I - as someone who exactly knows how nice it feels for a moment, if I was to inhale some nicotine right now... I wish I didn't knew that feeling. Because it's exactly what's causing me all those cravings. Knowing both, I'd be perfectly alright with the pleasure I can feel on my own. From small things like being around people, laughing, finishing something, to major releases of hormones for example when doing sports. These kinds of pleasure and endorphins are better anyways. And they are pure. The pleasure from drugs comes with consequences. You'll need to carry on taking the substance or it'll proceed to cause the adverse effect and make you feel bad.
It's dangerous. You can probably do it a few times. There are people who manage to smoke only on weekends or a few cigarettes a day. But it's a gradual thing and a slippery slope. You're now smoking 2 cigarettes or vaping a bit when with your friends. But chances are, next thing is, you're full on addicted and you won't even realize how it happened until it's too late.
I've come to the conclusion, I don't like the idea of being dependent on a substance to feel good, any more. And it's become too expensive anyways. For a long time in my life nicotine has been in control of my brain. Now I'm in control again.
A substance addiction has no benefits at all. Addiction is the opposite of freedom. Vaping is probably not that hazardous to your body. You can do it if you can afford it. If you don't value your freedom and don't mind handing over some amount of control over you to a substance. And make sure you never want to quit for any reason. Or you like being miserable and suffer from withdrawal. Let other people's stories be a warning to you. I personally don't mind if you try it without the nicotine and make sure it doesn't become a long-term behaviour. If you're currently smoking tobacco: Go for it. Vapes will solve almost all of your issues except for the nicotine addiction. That's the one thing vapes excel at.
Edit: By the way: I completely don't understand why people vape stuff without nicotine. It has even less benefits. You're not even feeling the little high. It's just a complete waste. You buy the stuff, inhale it and poof, it's gone. It leaves you with nothing except for maybe a slightly increased risk of getting cancer at some point. (And less money in your pockets, of course.)
Thank you very much for your really in-depth and informative response. I promise you I don’t have any hidden motives or plans - and I’m a lot older than 15, unfortunately! :-)
I really appreciated how you were honest and open about nicotine, vaping and the effects it had (and still has) on you, I think that kind of transparency, talking about the short-term positive effects but the long-term downsides is really helpful for people, and it’s a much more authentic and convincing anti-vaping message than the usual crap we get.
On the other hand, to return the favour, I guess I will be honest and say that a lot of the conversation around addiction seems a bit puritanical to me - obviously an addiction is never good, but it seems to ignore the fact that humans always seem to be looking for things to alter their brain chemistry for fun, and if we put nicotine (as vaped) alongside alcohol, caffeine and sugar, it doesn’t seem particularly more harmful than these. Obviously they are all different substances, but they all have their upsides and downsides.
Wanting to avoid dependence on a substance is also understandable. I haven’t really smoked (tried it once as a kid, as we all do, and felt really unwell and never went back!) so I don’t know what those feelings are like. I also have ADHD so my dopamine receptors are basically already phoning it in and I have a very addictive personality, so I’m pretty terrified of using addictive substances. I smoke weed from time to time and if someone mixes it with tobacco it’s a hard no. But I’m definitely addicted to sugar and caffeine, and sugar is definitely very harmful, and it’s impossible for me to quit/significantly cut down, I’ve tried, and it’s always a miserable experience that ends with me over-indulging once I give up on my attempt. But you rarely see people saying, “don’t ever drink soda, not even once” and you never really see them being taken seriously, but it seems to me that it’s probably more harmful than vaping.
It’s just a strange old world that we live in and I’m always trying to learn more about it. Thanks again for your response. I really appreciated it and enjoyed reading it. <3
I like you being curious and asking the right questions. I think I can empathize with most things you said. I'm just a regular person, not diagnosed with anything. But I also can relate to caffeine, sugar, ... playing a role in my life. Maybe I'm not spot on 'normal' when it comes to impulse control or dopamine receptors myself. People are different anyways... I absolutely like(d) the kick I got from nicotine. I could afford it and judging by the studies I read, it's not that harmful. So I always continued. If I could just vape a bit in the evening on weekends, I'd certainly wouldn't see a reason to stop and happily continue as of today. But unfortunately I can't. I'd be full on addicted the next day.
I think there is a range of addictiveness. And it depends on the substance. How easy it lures you in, how severe the consequences and health effects are, and the withdrawal and how complicated it is to overcome the addiction. These are independant from another. I think nicotine scores quite high on the addictiveness (for some people). But I can only compare it first hand to everyday substances. I've never done hard drugs and weed only once or twice. But I've cut down on sugar or caffeine. I've also had headaches from caffeine withdrawal. But it was easier.
I think you can even smoke or vape and get away with it. You just need one of the few brains that are wired to allow this and impose strict rules on yourself to limit exposure. And judging by the people I know, odds are always against you.
I think I should buy a mountainbike and from now on get my dopamine rush from speeding through the undergrowth instead of abusing substances. I'm going to continue using caffeine, though... abuse sugar and a beer or two every now and then. I'm not perfect. And I don't strive for being a perfect human. Whatever that would be.
which absolutely drowns out the ability to find information about the negative health effects of a typical vape user buying name-brand products from reputable suppliers
It is true that the 2019 EVALI outbreak linked to tocopheryl acetate contamination got a lot of media attention, but there is evidence of other vaping-related harm.
The review article summarises some of the more recent evidence from across a lot of different studies: https://www.mdpi.com/1660-4601/20/19/6808.
I specifically asked people not to share studies, because people can pretty easily dig them out themselves, but also because they’re academic documents which most people can’t interpret. I’m looking for personal accounts in this thread.
Do you, or have you ever, vaped?
If you're asking this because you're considering starting - dont. I vaped for a little while in college, started out with the 0 nicotine juices, but after trying a few nicotine ones I found I liked the "throat hit" you got from the nicotine versions, as well as the head high.
One day I lost my vape and that's when I realized how unexpectedly I got hooked. I stopped then and there and it's only because I hadn't been at it too long that I was able to quit cold turkey and permanently (10 years since then now).
The fact is that on the "pro" side, you get a mild buzz, and only when you're vaping stronger concentrations than you're used to and that's about it. I started because I thought it was cool and it was a conversation starter at parties (vaping was more novel then and college freshmen are easy to impress), but I'm so glad I knocked that shit off before it really got it's hooks into me.
On the con side its expensive, unhealthy (only considered "healthy" when compared to sucking smoke), uncool to everyone over the age of 20, and highly addictive (if using nicotine, but even if you plan to stick with 0 nicotine juice, you may eventually cave, I did.)
Basically there's very little reason to start and a lot of really compelling reasons to never pick it up
Thank you so much for sharing your story. How long had you been vaping before you lost your vape?
6 months or so, I'd say
I started in college. Vaped for around 8 years like constantly. Once you're really addicted your body tells you you're getting pleasure from vaping, but really you're just temporarily setting back how bad it feels to not vape. You're literally having a miniature panic attack every time you crave it and stopping it by doing it.
Been clean for a year now. My overall stress level is WAY lower than while vaping. Felt that after a few months in a big way. I've also got high blood pressure. I ran out of my prescription blood pressure meds the same day I quit. A month later when I went to the doctor my BP was significantly lower than when I was on them, so literally quitting did more for my BP than prescription meds.
I sleep a lot better now too. Also, not having to constantly sneak away, or get grumpy on a plane, etc. Also also, to do with the blood pressure, but as a dude sexual performance is notably better.
Don't start vaping.
I was in my early 20s when I started. Wanted the calming effects of nicotine, was into other similar interests, and was dating someone who also got into it. He was actually the second vaper I'd dated, so you could say it took me a while to be interested.
I'd had a couple cigs before but I never considered myself a smoker and didn't take to it. Vaping became a huuuge hobby for me. Learning about different mods, building your own coils, DIY e-juice, etc. I was vaping all day, all the time, pretty much as soon as I woke up (at the lowest amount possible though). It was a nice flavor and chemical pick me up when I was on edge. Sort of like a physical distraction. I vaped for 5 or so years. The lasting effects I've noticed are that sometimes I miss it. That's it. It was pretty hard to quit, mostly because I didn't want to. I had a lot of resistance, because it became a passion for me. But nicotine regulations started to suck, and that same partner quit as well. I got really sick with a flu and didn't vape during it. Then, I didn't start again after I got better. I had dreams about it, and it took a bit for me to want to move on.
The thing is, though, I don't feel any different now than when I was vaping constantly. It doesn't improve your life that much. It'd be great if it could be an occasional thing, like alcohol or dessert is, but it's hard to not do it all the time if you're doing it at all. And you get to an equilibrium where it just doesn't feel that strong. Hence the constant clouds.
The most annoying part about it is that it becomes like a security blanket. You have to take it everywhere. Forget it for work? Guess you'll just be late today. Have to sit for a movie? Man it sucks not to vape inside. Flying for hours? What a nightmare, can't wait to land and go outside.
It was annoying to not feel myself if I ever decided to leave my vape behind. And blowing clouds out of my car was great, but it sucked having to wipe down my car windshield all the time due to the glycerin condensation. Same with inside -- no smoke on the walls, but the glycerine would hang around and I'd have to run an air purifier. I'd often worry about the vapor leaving slight residue all over my apartment, belongings, monitors, PC internals and such.
Overall, it was great for a while as it was something I got really into, but it was also a lot of money and stress over something that didn't really benefit my life the way other hobbies still continue to do. Much better to be a free person unattached from adult security blankets. 😎
~18.
See answer below.
No.
No.
Yes.
Yes.
I started vaping around when I was 18, back when disposable coils were first starting to be a thing and the paradigm was mainly making your own coils, testing resistance, and then pulling your own cotton. Very much a manual process, and not a known thing just yet. Smoke shops were just starting to carry juice.
I started after I got in trouble at work for eating sunflower seeds. Back then I had a pretty bad tick where I had to do something with my mouth quite often. My coworker mentioned it and I saw it as an alternative, I also liked the idea of replacing caffeine with nicotine as a stimulant.
Easy to guess, but my symptoms and tick were ADHD related. It worked for a short while, but soon I was using both caffeine and nicotine, though by the time I quit vaping for the first time I had completely gotten over the tick.
Since I started I've been through a few cycles of quitting and resuming. I've never quit because I saw it as an addiction, and mainly have quit for financial or health reasons, if any at all. And by health I'm referring to purely the impact stimulants had on my blood pressure, nothing to do with vaping itself.
Being ADHD my addictions have always been as transient as my hobbies, and I've quit both nicotine and caffeine multiple times and only the last few times grew conscious of the withdrawal symptoms.
I do recognize it as a legitimate addiction, as the time I quit intentionally (asthmatic friend was visiting) I did notice the desire to resume, although that may also be related to finally finding working ADHD treatment.
If you plan properly you can use 0nic liquid and mix it with nic liquid to slowly wean yourself off nicotine, and have personally coached two people through this process, one of which was a lifetime smoker.
Aside from health concerns from nicotine itself, the only health issue I've had from vaping was suffocating myself by vaping too much lol.
I do think vaping in public should be treated the same as smoking, and that access be behind an age restriction. But I don't see it as anything more than a mildly unhealthy vice. My addiction to sugar and sweet stuff has been much more harmful to me and is completely unchecked here in the US.
I really regret it.I picked it up during the pandemic due to boredom and got hooked to the headrush. I tried to quit because it makes me anxious and I no longer get any positive effects from it but the cravings are insane and Wellbutrin did not help with it.
Thank you for sharing your experience, and I’m sorry that you’re suffering from it. Could it be possible to taper your nicotine dosage down gradually to help with quitting?
I'll give it a shot during my annual leave with the help of a specialist to end this habit.
You are not alone. Quitting nicotine isn't easy. But I can assure you it's doable. If you can get help with that, do it. I've read somewhere (about smoking) getting help by a specialist increases the odds by a significant margin. Making you more likely to succeed than not.
Wish you the best.
Thank you for your kind words. Nicotine addiction is sneaky and expensive 😅
Thanks - did you quit because you had heard about health issues? How long did you vape before quitting? What issues did you hear about that most influenced you to quit?
Nah, I quit because she went to a different company and was no longer friends with me, so I no longer had a reason to vape lol. If it wasn't for the girl, I would've never picked it up. IMO it's a waste of money + with all the health concerns, there's no point in vaping.
Thanks for sharing!
What age were you when you started vaping?
Around 50.
Why did you start?
A friend was vaping to stop smoking and was complaning about flavors and cost of the juice. I wanted to DIY for him and ended up enjoying the overall experience.
Note: descreasig nic mg for him, 0mg for me.
Do you regret having ever started? If so, why do you regret it?
No.
Have you noticed any long-term negative health effects from vaping?
No.
Do you feel that the socialogical and/or legal issues around vaping are more or less of a concern than health effects?
Big Tobacco and neo-puritains have teamed up to flood the zone with FUD. A classic "baptist and bootlegger" scenario.
Do you feel that the financial cost of vaping is more or less of a concern than the health effects?
DIYing one's one coils and juice can make the cost quite minimal, and increase control over what you put into your body.
Interesting, thank you for sharing. What would you say you most enjoy about vaping? How much e-liquid do you get through in, say, a month? Have you ever been tempted to try e-liquid containing nicotine?
What would you say you most enjoy about vaping?
How much e-liquid do you get through in, say, a month?
I don't remember, it's been a few years. Maybe a hundred ml?
Have you ever been tempted to try e-liquid containing nicotine?
I had bulk nic for making juice for others. I do not enjoy nicotine and would not take it for recreational purposes. There is some evidence that there are neuroprotective aspects, so had I continued I might have added 0.5mg/ml or something for that purpose.
I stopped because I travel fulltime now and the constant altitude changes caused constant leaking and mess.
Vapes can be as bad as smoking for you but there are restrictions to it like it smelling like shit which at least prevents teens from starting it to some extend. When it comes to vape its new it actually does smell kinda good,its colorful and packaged like a toy. Vape is the cousin of cigarettes that is designed to exploit younger people. Don't do it
All of the evidence says that vaping is much less harmful than smoking, so I’m afraid that I will have to disagree with you on that. This kind of misinformed comment is not helpful to discourage vaping, as it just makes all anti-vaping messaging seem deceptive, which is why I asked for personal stories from people about their experience.
I agree with what you wrote about vape products being marketed at young people, but that isn’t the focus of this post.
Having had our school call ambulances to scrape teen students off the bathroom floor due to vape smoking on several occasions now, I can tell you that there are health risks. We have also had several teens contract unexpected asthma for "no reason" after vaping. Sorry if yu have been misinfoemed by the hype, but consult a doctor instead of a publicist for a truthful rundown on the true short and long term risks of vaping.
I would have been interested in your perspective if it wasn’t for your attitude. You seem really aggressive and chauvinistic, so I don’t really want to engage further.
Heh. "That word you keep saying. I do not think it means what you think it means....."
Seriously mate, consult a doctor instead of the internet if you want truth instead of your own chosen fiction.
You’re the only person I’ve had a problem with in all of these comments, I would have really appreciated your opinion and I would have enjoyed hearing more about your experiences, but you’re talking down to me and treating me poorly for asking challenging questions and sharing non-controversial facts. Not only that but you’re making massive assumptions about my opinions and actions. And despite all of that, you still think that you’re in the right. It’s unbelievably arrogant behaviour, and I really hope you overcome it.