Some background: My Mom is a lib, but not a superlib. She is disgusted by what's happening in gaza, doesn't really belive the democrats have her best interests at heart, etc. She thinks she consumes diverse media but it's really only what the local radio station plays. (NPR, BBC World Service.) Whenever I bring up the issue of supporting the democrats when they are actively committing genocide, she agrees with how disgusting it is but also doesn't believe it's not worth voting for Kamala over. ("I can't let this be the reason trump becomes president again.") She also doesn't believe that Kamala and Biden are actively praticipating in the genocide - she thinks the money will get sent either way. I know. She was extremely disillusioned with the dems before Joe dropped out but after they tagged Kopmalla in she's been fairly excited. She likes Kamala somewhat, very much likes that she's a woman, and very much dislikes trump. Anytime I call her out on her inconsistencies in belief vs how she votes (not that voting really matters but its the principal) she talks about how she as a mother and a woman can't let Trump win again.

Anyways, I had a very productive conversation with her last night. I basically convinced her that Kamala will lose, and deserves to lose because she won't shift her policy on Gaza. I also told her that Jill Stein doesn't need to win, she just needs to get to 5% to change the political landscape of this country. (I know that Stein is far from ideal but she's not a LIB , she's an easy pill for much more people to swallow and she has the best shot of 5%. The PSL is far better, but I'm supporting Jill this cycle.) I think what finally woke my Mom up is when I said, "You always talk about wanting to make change somehow, and this is a way to make change but you won't take it because that's what others have told you not to do." That really seemed to strike a cord and I feel like she really hears me for the first time.

Now she's at the point where she can't hear it any more from me, but needs a little boost further to radicalize her against the democratic party. If any hexbears have some good resources on subjects like the lack of the lesser of two evils, the democrats enactment of project 2025, how getting Stein to 5% helps, the ease at which Biden and Kamala could end the genocide, etc they'd be much appreciated.

I typed this out in like 5 minutes on my phone so I hope any of it makes sense. Also if we could avoid dunking on my mom, that'd be great - she's a lib but she made me who I am and is amazing also.

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[–] thelastaxolotl@hexbear.net 27 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)

The Greens are a bunch of libs but if they win their 5% it would make some very annoying people very angry which is a positive

[–] infuziSporg@hexbear.net 6 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

The only times when a third party has broken 2% in the last quarter century were 2000 and 2016, both in which voters were extremely disillusioned with the two main parties. I don't think we're in that kind of moment this year.

[–] MayoPete@hexbear.net 6 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

Voters SHOULD be extremely disillusioned over both parties. They are both materially supporting a genocide doomer

[–] infuziSporg@hexbear.net 3 points 2 weeks ago

They should, but there's a lot less urgency, people dislike Kamala a lot less than they do Biden or Hillary (so far so-far ), and Trump is no longer so disastrous-sounding as we've seen what he did in 1 term.

And I hate to say it, but the average American is probably more offended at the botched withdrawal from Afghanistan than the genocide in Gaza.

[–] REgon@hexbear.net 4 points 2 weeks ago

Leftists solidarity chuds
Libs are annoying and it's funny to annoy them

[–] LaughingLion@hexbear.net 18 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)

hate to break it to you but stein is, in fact, a LIB in very big ways and the green party is generally "china bad uighar genocide" so no thanks ill stick with claudia thanks

[–] real@hexbear.net 15 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

Yeah but I’d rather those close to me vote for someone who is explicitly anti zionist than a zionist. Plus, I really do want to see the dems lose another election “because of the greens”.

[–] LaughingLion@hexbear.net 2 points 2 weeks ago

the person below you posted the green party support for a plan to infringe upon iran's sovereignty and relinquish aspects of their nuclear program to western oversight which in turn empowers and emboldens the zionists so before you claim they are antizionist please consider that they are, in fact, not. they might be outspoken against this genocide, which is of course, cool and good, but in the long term policies like that only strengthen the zionist position in the region

[–] Evilphd666@hexbear.net 12 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (1 children)

I want to prefrence this with I have nothing against the PSL. They are fighting the same fight and I consider them allies.

Is this because of the Butch Ware thing? Because that's not the US Green Party stance. The only mention of China in their platform was it being part of a joint nuclear non proliferation with Iran.

https://www.gp.org/democracy#demForeignPolicy

Iran

The Green Party supports the "joint comprehensive plan of action" signed in July, 2015 by Iran and the P5+1 (five permanent members of the UN Security Council: China, France, Russia, United Kingdom, United States plus Germany), and the European Union, which confirms Iran's status as a zone free of nuclear weapons. According to the United States National Intelligence Estimate, Iran halted an alleged active nuclear weapons program in the Fall of 2003. Iran, which has signed the Nuclear Non-proliferation Treaty, has consistently called for a nuclear-free zone in the entire Middle East.

The "joint comprehensive plan of action" provides that in return for Iran upholding its agreements to rid itself of nuclear material as verified by inspections by the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA), current economic sanctions by the US, European Union and UN Security Council will be lifted. The Green Party supports the swift elimination of these economic sanctions on Iran and looks to the normalization of relations between Iran and the United States. In keeping with UN resolutions call for a nuclear-free Middle East, the Green Party also calls on Israel, the only nuclear power in the Middle East with at least 200 nuclear warheads, to dismantle its nuclear weapons program and sign on to the Nuclear Non-proliferation Treaty.

[–] LaughingLion@hexbear.net 3 points 2 weeks ago

yeah, yikes, that makes the green party even worse of a LIB party imho

iran should not ever, and i repeat, EVER, abandon any pursuit of anything nuclear and in fact has a legal and moral obligation to development its own nuclear arsenal as a deterrent to the west. any effort to infringe upon this basic sovereign right is imperialist and must be vehemetly opposed by any self proclaimed socialist. any socialist who would support such a platform is also a LIB

[–] ProjectCyberSin@hexbear.net 14 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)

I read that at as get my lib mom to vote for Stalin.

[–] REgon@hexbear.net 8 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

same-picture

Jill Stein
J I L L S T E I N

move some letters around

I O S E F A S T J L I N E
J O S E F S T A L I N

And what does that spell?

Vladimir Ilych Lenin

Coincidence? I think not.

Edit: Gonna make a street racer anime with either a protagonist or antagonist called JOSEF FASTLINE who was a big wario mustache and drives a souped-up red Lada

[–] real@hexbear.net 6 points 2 weeks ago

That’s the next goal

[–] Bobson_Dugnutt@hexbear.net 10 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

Also worth pointing out that unless you live in a swing state, voting Democrat does literally nothing

[–] real@hexbear.net 10 points 2 weeks ago

She does live in a swing state but it’s a good poibt

[–] alexandra_kollontai@hexbear.net 5 points 2 weeks ago

critical support to stein for making a lot of people very angry about electoralism