I was just reading this post https://old.reddit.com/r/selfhosted/comments/1gmv76n/is_reddit_going_to_remain_the_primary_space_for/ and many barely see the fediverse as an alternative and they seem to have a negative bias towards it. Super ironic when it comes to the self-hosting community. Yes, some instances are problematic, yes, some devs might have had problematic views. But it doesn't really matter when it's federated and FOSS. I think it's clear-cut that the selfhosting community on Lemmy is a perfect alternative to reddit. Why is there such a negative bias?

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[–] Shatur@lemmy.ml 1 points 1 day ago (8 children)

You do understand that good things can be achieved without mass killings

I never implied that deaths were necessary.

No, they support the killing of Ukrainians

That's a bold claim. Condemn actual people's statements. You're making a strawman to justify your hate.

NATO expansion is determined by national self-determination

That's the weirdest explanation I've ever heard 😅 You're also using the word "genocide" wrong. Genocide is a purposeful attempt to destroy any human group. In the case of Russia, that's just imperialism - they simply don't care about Ukrainians (sadly). Otherwise, any war could be called genocidal.

[–] Alphane_Moon@lemmy.world 1 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (7 children)

Then why are you white-washing Mao's atrocities? Surely, if you think the death and absurd brutality (cultural revolution?) is not good thing, you would support movements and leaders who don't engage in such conducts.

Come on now. Don't play dumb.

They openly support and cheer for the Russian invasion? Why would I not hate them for this?

Show me an example of them condemning russian atrocities. Just one. I shouldn't hate people who white-wash russian crimes and claim they never happened?

Show me an example of them recognizing Ukrainian self-determination? One shouldn't hate people who want you to be a colony of the shithole that is russia?

Where is the strawman?

One would have to be a genocidal imperialist to state that a country should not have the right to aspire to join NATO (especially if you border russia).

Try speaking Ukrainian in the occupied territories or opening a Ukrainian Orthodox Church.

No, you just want to white wash russian crimes and the degenerates at Lemmygrad.

For example, when the US invaded Iraq, did they do the following:

Annex Basra and make it a new state
Ban Arabic in Basra and send anyone who is using it to a torture camp
Steal local children to continental US and force them to recite American national polemics
Ban Iraqi citizens from using any public services in the newly annexed Basra and force them to get US citizenship.

[–] Shatur@lemmy.ml 1 points 1 day ago (6 children)

Then why are you white-washing Mao's atrocities?

I never did 🤷. White-washing is when you try to justify or make something bad look good. I'm simply saying that he did both good and bad things, and some people admire him for the good parts. So, if someone likes Mao, it doesn’t necessarily mean they support the deaths he caused.

Where is the strawman?

I assert that people on Lemmygrad oppose NATO expansion and believe that the US is the greater evil. You claim that they wish harm upon Ukrainians. However, opposing US imperialism does not mean they want the Ukrainian people to suffer.

For example, looking at the upvotes on this comment from Lemmygrad's world news, it's clear that they feel sympathy for Ukraine. There are individuals, like this commenter, who suggest bombing Ukraine, but the comment is downvoted.

This is why I wouldn’t say that people on Lemmygrad want your nation to suffer. I don’t necessarily agree with their opinions, but they certainly don't deserve death.

[–] Alphane_Moon@lemmy.world 1 points 1 day ago (1 children)

But you are trying to make something bad look good. Mao is a bad person. He is a mass murder, an authoritarian. Good things can and should be achieved without mass murder.

Their opposition to NATO expansion is just another facet of their support for genocidal imperialism because they know that being in NATO makes it much less likely that russians will invade. The "US greater evil" is all BS. If they truely believed that they would move to russia or china. But they don't, they LARP as communists while stuffing their mouths with Big Macs and playing US-developed video games (in which they try to role play their imperialist fantasies).

For example, looking at the upvotes on this comment from Lemmygrad’s world news, it’s clear that they feel sympathy for Ukraine. There are individuals, like this commenter, who suggest bombing Ukraine, but the comment is downvoted.

Really, this is best you could find? You're really grasping at straws here. How is this a proxy war? Russian literally invaded my country. This is a russian genocidal invasion. If the Americans forced everyone in a hypothetically annexed Basra to eat tex-mex pork chops and banned Arabic and sent anyone caught speaking it to torture camps, you wouldn't call it genocidal imperialism? Just war, right?

I asked you some clear and direct questions and you come up with BS? Do you even believe what you are writing or are you just essentially shitposting?

We both know they actively support and cheer on the russian invasion. In an explicit and genuine manner. They want russia to be successful in its invasion of Ukraine. They want Ukrainian speakers in the occupied territories to be sent to torture camps. It is not difficult to say the russians were wrong to invade and it is wrong to commit atrocities and torture people (instead of just blaming Ukraine for mobilization).

Why should I not hate them for this? Why shouldn't I want them to meet the same fate as the “Donbas Cowboy”, Russell Bentley? Just imagine what was going through his mind in his last moments - must have a been a true moment of clarity. I want them to achieve that same that same level of clarity.

Can you explain this to me? You keep ignoring this point.

[–] Shatur@lemmy.ml 1 points 1 day ago* (last edited 23 hours ago) (1 children)

But you are trying to make something bad look good. Mao is a bad person.

No, you implied that if someone likes Mao, then they support killing. And I said that it's not the case - Marxists like him because of the good things he did and condemn the murders.

Really, this is best you could find?

You said that they wish Ukrainians death. I said that I doubt it and provided messages that prove my point. You made up their statements and are arguing against them.

Consider this thread as an example. Read what they actually say. You blame only Russia, they think NATO plays important role as well. But no normal person wants the war, that's what I trying to say.

you wouldn’t call it genocidal imperialism? Just war, right?

If the violence is the primary goal, then it's called genocide.

I also doubt that Russia banned the Ukrainian language or sent people to torture camps for speaking it. Could you provide a source for this?

Why shouldn’t I want them to meet the same fate... Can you explain this to me? You keep ignoring this point.

I answered a few messages above. I doubt that the devs wish harm to Ukraine or people in general. And even if they did, you would be no better than them 🤷

[–] Alphane_Moon@lemmy.world 1 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Of course, they support the killing. If they didn't, they wouldn't glorify Mao; a mass murders and an authoritarian scumbag.

Yes, they do wish Ukrainians death. They support the russian invasion and the russian occupation. The instance is rife with cheering for the russian army.

The NATO stuff is a ruse. Just a way to cover their support for genocidal imperialism. Ukraine was neutral ... wait for it ... before the russians invaded.

That thread is a cesspool of support russian genocidal imperialim.

Communists want the war to end and blame NATO for provoking and prolonging it.

This basically means we want russia to win to conduct more atrocities likes in Bucha. Just wild uncontrolled killing of civilians, rape and destruction. And Bucha is just one example that got in the news. There are mass graves in Izyum. Russians targeting civilians with drones in Kherson. Russians bombing a children's cancer hospital with cruise missile.

But no, NATO made them do it! And not a word about russian atrocities.

I also doubt that Russia banned the Ukrainian language or sent people to torture camps for speaking it. Could you provide a source for this?

You do know how to use web search, right? You're just going to say some non-sequitur about NATO and bla bla bla or that it's all made up.

https://apnews.com/article/ukraine-russia-prisons-civilians-torture-detainees-88b4abf2efbf383272eed9378be13c72

https://edition.cnn.com/2024/05/05/europe/ukrainian-civilians-detained-russian-prisons-intl-cmd/index.html

https://khpg.org/en/1608814097

I answered a few messages above. I doubt that the devs wish harm to Ukraine or people in general. And even if they did, you would be no better than them 🤷

That's not what I asked though.

We both agree that lemmygrad actively support the russian invasion of Ukraine. They cheer on the invasion and call for russian military success? Is this not true?

I asked you why I shouldn't hate them for it? Nothing to do with being no better them or whatever. I asked why I shouldn't hate people who support the invasion of my country and wish me harm?

[–] Shatur@lemmy.ml 1 points 21 hours ago (1 children)

Of course, they support the killing.

Let's see what they actually say.

Yes, they do wish Ukrainians death.

This basically means we want russia to win to conduct more atrocities likes in Bucha.

Well, I’m not sure how you’re interpreting this from the link I provided. You just making up their statements. I don’t want to have to cite their comments every time just to provide a counter-claim.

You’re just going to say some non-sequitur about NATO

AP is a credible source, and there’s no doubt that Russian forces have harmed civilians. However, the claim that all Ukrainians who speak their language are imprisoned is questionable. For instance, Chechen is an official language in Russia despite two wars with Russia. Additionally, Russia provides citizenship to all Ukrainians, why would they imprison people for their native language? The article you referenced cites Radio Svoboda, which has ties to the CIA, so it's not a reliable source.

I asked you why I shouldn’t hate them for it?

I think my answer is correct. You’re accusing them of supporting murder, yet you wish harm upon them yourself. If you prefer analogies, it's like condemning murder while being guilty of it yourself.

[–] Alphane_Moon@lemmy.world 1 points 13 hours ago* (last edited 13 hours ago) (1 children)

I told you would downplay russian atrocities and come up with some CIA word salad. You've never been to Ukraine, you don't speak Ukrainian and you dare lecture me and tell me that russian invasion is not that bad?

Get fucked, you vile tankie! I hope the very atrocities you deny will catch up to you one day!

[–] Shatur@lemmy.ml 1 points 11 hours ago

come up with some CIA word salad.

Sure, anything that doesn't align with your worldview is just word salad😅

tell me that russian invasion is not that bad?

That's not what I said, but whatever 🤷

Hope some day you chill and won't be that toxic.

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