unix like operating system lovers

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This is a community that is only for nerds jk. everyone who doesn't scare when seeing UNIX terminal welcome! rules:

don't make comments that branch out from the main topic too much, at least please somehow relate to it.
retro operating systems, e.g. discussion about them, is strictly forbidden, please make a retro community instead.
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I have no idea what I'm doing, help! (sh.itjust.works)

submitted 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) by tempestuousknave@sh.itjust.works to c/unix@sh.itjust.works

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Every other forum has rules about these posts because there's such a glut of them, and yes, I could go read a stickied thread elsewhere, but here I am not doing that.

How would someone with no computer skills get acquainted with the OS? What version would you recommend to the hopeless novice? Can I keep windows on my PC and run the new OS or a practice version of it in a partitioned space while I learn? Can someone with minimal skills/time/patience be happy with a unix-like OS?

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[–] captain_aggravated@sh.itjust.works 1 points 1 year ago (2 children)

I learned how to use Linux from Youtube videos and Raspberry Pi tutorials.

I personally like Linux Mint, though I would suggest trying out a few to see what you like better. A lot of your choice will come down to Desktop Environment choice, rather than Distro choice, and at first those will feel like one in the same. If this starts a "well actually" subthread below this comment, it won't be the first time ;)

You can indeed keep Windows on your PC and run Linux in several ways:

You can run Linux in a virtual machine. Using something like VirtualBox, you can basically store the operating system in a file, and it runs the Linux OS in a window on your PC desktop. This is great for trying them out, practicing, or just keeping a spare environment around.
You can use the Live Environment. If you've ever installed Windows before, you know how the installer isn't "Windows?" It's this kind of empty feeling weird thing? You can't just boot the Windows installer up and run Windows apps, you have to actually install it on the machine. Yeah, not Linux. Most Linux distros nowadays can be burned to a DVD or written to a thumb stick, you boot to that disc or stick, and it boots to the desktop, and you can use it right there. It'll have an "Install" icon on the desktop, but you can just...not install it and use it from the USB stick. Some distros are designed specifically to be used that way, for niche applications.
You can dual boot. Linux's bootloader, GRUB, includes a menu system to choose multiple operating systems from. It's possible to shove Windows aside and install Linux next to it, so every time you boot the computer, you can choose which OS to run on it. I did that for years.

Ultimately I suggest you do all three. Try out a few distros in VirtualBox, pick one or two you like best. Put those on some thumb drives, and then run them in the live environment to make sure they run well on your computer. When you finally decide you want to permanently install one, I recommend dual booting for awhile. Reason being, you'll probably find those little moments where you need to get something done, and you know how to do it in Windows, and you're just struggling to figure out how in Linux...don't get spooled up. Boot into Windows, get it done, turn it in. Once that time pressure to get it done RIGHT NOW is gone, learn how to do that task in Linux, without that pressure it will be easier to find the information. Eventually you'll stop booting to Windows.

Oh, and Welcome to the Linux community!

[–] tempestuousknave@sh.itjust.works 0 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Thank you! I really enjoy the way you present information, and I like the progression prescribed.

I've caught a lot of second hand tech talk, living in society as I do, so I have enough casual exposure to feel like I know what things are without actually knowing what they are. None of the terminology is new to me, and it feels silly to ask questions like "what's a virtual machine?" when the answer is both common knowledge and self-evident, but the truth is I don't really know.

I mean, I do, I just read that virtual machines are computers inside your computer comprised of software (code) rather than physical components, which have their own operating system that can function entirely differently from the physical computers OS, and are insulated from access to your actual computers software. But what does that mean?

Lets say I run Linux Mint for in a virtual machine. How would programs that were installed via windows interact with virtual linux - could they? Would I have to install a virtual program? If the preexisting programs are operable, would they be operating in linux, or in windows at the command of linux (I'm aware that command has another meaning in tech speak, but so do the applicable synonyms, this is the least confusing I could come up with). Would I need new (virtual?) drivers for my wireless peripherals to use them in virtual linux? Is the operation of a program (or app, the terms are interchangeable at my knowledge level) in a virtual box a fair test of the operation of the program in the actual linux OS?

What about all of that stuff in a live environment? What's the difference between linux in a virtual box and linux in a live environment? I would expect that live environments don't insulate your computer from risk the way that virtual boxes do, but beyond that I can't even guess. Do virtual boxes insulate innately by virtue of not being computers, or does it need to be designed to be insulating?

What are the disadvantages of dual booting? Linux seems to have a small footprint, and space is fairly cheap. Why do people make games work in linux when they could dual boot? Does booting a different OS take significantly more time than rebooting? Do things ever get funky when you have two OS sharing a machine?

[–] captain_aggravated@sh.itjust.works 1 points 1 year ago

Virtual Machines If you've ever used a video game emulator, you're pretty close to the experience of a virtual machine. VirtualBox or similar will provide a window on your Windows desktop in which you'll boot a completely separate OS. That guest OS has no idea it's not running on real hardware; VirtualBox pretends to be generic PC hardware and translates it to system commands to the host OS. The two OSes aren't aware of each other, and they don't share data or software. Because VirtualBox pretends to be a generic PC, the generic drivers built into the operating system should work; I wouldn't put it past Linux to have VirtualBox specific drivers built in. When you download a Linux ISO and plug it into VirtualBox, it will very likely "just work." Watch a Youtube video on the process to see what I mean.

"is the operation of a program in VirtualBox a fair test of the operation of the program in the actual OS?" Maybe. Generally speaking software is going to run better on a native OS (running on bare metal) than in a guest OS in VirtualBox, first because there's not a whole other OS running on the system hogging up resources, and second in the case of like CAD software or games, access to a graphics card is kinda tricky. So games probably run very poorly in VirtualBox compared to on real hardware. There may be cases where software runs better in a virtual environment but I feel that's rare.

Live Environments. A live environment is running on bare metal; You will shut the computer down and then boot the whole computer from an external drive, typically a USB thumb drive these days. When you boot a Linux live environment, Windows is not running at all; Linux is in direct control of the hardware, and it can mount and write to a Windows partition if present. It is very unlikely to hurt anything unless you tell it to, and if you're really paranoid you can physically disconnect the Windows drive.

The live environment is designed to let you see the system run on the computer to make sure it runs well, and to provide the environment from which the installer will run. There are some systems that are designed to be run from the live environment, like TAILS, but in general it's a temporary utility.

Dual booting* There are some disadvantages of dual booting; it eats up more space, there's two OSes to update and maintain, and moving files between the two isn't always fun since Windows and Linux use different file systems (NTFS vs EXT4, for example).

They will sometimes fight; Windows likes to take back the bootloader and prevent the menu from showing, booting straight into Windows; that's always fun to fix.

There's also the issue of the Real Time Clock. Windows likes to set the hardware clock to local time; Linux likes to set it to GMT, so one or the other will read incorrectly. Both OSes can be set to do it the other's way; you can set Windows to use GMT with a registry setting, xor set Linux to use local time via a timedatectl command in the terminal.

It doesn't take much more time to shut down and boot to the other OS; there is a menu for you to choose between them, which can add a few seconds.

As for why bother with Linux gaming...you want to get away from Windows, right? That's why people bother making Linux compatible games. I don't want to keep Microsoft around just to play games when Linux can do it just fine.