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submitted 5 days ago by girlfreddy@lemmy.ca to c/canada@lemmy.ca

A $2.14-billion federal loan for an Ottawa-based satellite operator has Canadian politicians arguing about whether American billionaire Elon Musk poses a national security risk.

The fight involves internet connectivity in remote regions as Canada tries to live up to its promise to connect every Canadian household to high-speed internet by 2030.

A week ago, the Liberal government announced the loan to Telesat, which is launching a constellation of low Earth orbit satellites that will be able to connect the most remote areas of the country to broadband internet.

Conservative MP Michael Barrett objected to the price tag, asking Musk in a social media post how much it would cost to provide his Starlink to every Canadian household that does not have high-speed access.

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[-] AnotherDirtyAnglo@lemmy.ca 14 points 3 days ago

Yeah, I see no problem putting #SpaceKaren in charge of our telecommunications.

Oh. Wait. He turns off Starlink to entire countries when he feels like it, and tells entire countries to fuck off when they ask for reasonable limits on accounts of bad actors. There's also a very odd connection to Russia... a lot of this exceedingly bizarre behaviour started after having met with Putin a couple years back.

Relying on this increasinly unreliable idiot for anything is a bad idea.

[-] match@pawb.social 52 points 4 days ago

"$2.14 billion for a local company?! why don't we just have a foreign billionaire do it for $2.09 billion and then another $1 billion when he fucks it up?"

[-] TerkErJerbs@lemm.ee 13 points 4 days ago

It's an easy reaction to have when you only read the headline. But if you do the math, Starlink already provides service to most of the north at less than $200/mo per person. There are less than 120k people in the northern territories. That 2.2bn works out to something like 85 years of Starlink service per person in the north (assuming everyone there needs an individual dish, which isn't the case). Myself and a couple of other commentors have done some looking into Telesat as a company and they launched one (1) LEO "test sat" in 2018 and haven't done a fucking thing since to get northern people online in a timely fashion.

If you actually talk to people who live in the north most of them who can afford to already have Starlink, because it works far better than Xplore which was the only option previously, for many years. Most northern mining, logging, and oil camps are also getting their workers online with Starlink and have been for a few years already.

I've not a fan of Elon, or the canadian libs, or the conservative party. But this whole discussion is kinda bullshit. As far as I'm concerned Elon Musk is guillotine lube, top of the list. The day after he is beheaded, Starlink as a company will continue operating. Which, frankly, is best-case scenario. idk what else to say about that.

[-] Mothproof4712@lemmy.ca 13 points 4 days ago

I think you calculated 85 months, not years, which are almost exactly 7 years.

[-] TerkErJerbs@lemm.ee 2 points 2 days ago

Yeah caught that. Appropriately apologetic for even trying to use a calculator. I'm a HS dropout, what can I say ๐Ÿ˜‚

Thanks for fact-checking.

[-] DragonTypeWyvern@midwest.social 8 points 4 days ago

I think Starlink is stealing our sky and every C- level in the company should be shot and their holdings seized and sold to fund running fiber cables or whatever to rural communities.

I believe this to be a fair and equitable compromise between our positions, hbu?

[-] TassieTosser@aussie.zone 3 points 3 days ago

Have we learned nothing about putting all our dependence on foreign mega corps? Spending more to build up local talent is a good thing.

[-] TerkErJerbs@lemm.ee 2 points 2 days ago

I'm with you on that. I really am. However I'm also for people in the north getting online effectively before another decades passes. The government (and that's not just the libs) have been promising this shit since the early oughts, and throwing money at it that seldom seems to do any good.

[-] smallpatatas@lemm.ee 6 points 4 days ago

You may want to double-check that math ;)

[-] TerkErJerbs@lemm.ee 2 points 2 days ago

Yeah caught that. Appropriately apologetic for even trying to use a calculator. I'm a HS dropout, what can I say ๐Ÿ˜‚

Thanks for fact-checking.

[-] wise_pancake@lemmy.ca 9 points 3 days ago

Nothing is more conservative than selling off Canadian interests to foreign companies.

[-] Rentlar@lemmy.ca 98 points 5 days ago

Sure on the surface going with Elon's plan may be less costly. But like a deal with the devil, you realize the cost is more than money.

The cost is Elon deciding when his system will actually work for customers

The cost is Elon flouting laws and courts as it suits him

The cost is Elon considering himself above all laws internationally

He is going to put himself over Canadians every single time if we allow ourselves to rely on him. Sure you can have a contract that says keep the price fixed or whatever, but Elon will need to be dragged kicking and screaming to enforce anything.

[-] FunderPants@lemmy.ca 20 points 5 days ago

Conservatives only deal with what's on the surface so everything past your first sentence will mean nothing to them.

[-] pupbiru@aussie.zone 2 points 3 days ago

not to mention apparently there have been recent studies that predict the deorbiting of all the satellites is going to have drastic climate effects

[-] alsimoneau@lemmy.ca 47 points 5 days ago

LEO internet is not sustainable and should be banned.

If you want satellite internet geosync is way better. The only downside is latency but it's not worth destroying the planet and ruining astronomy globally over.

[-] phoenixz@lemmy.ca 17 points 4 days ago

This. I was about to write the same.

Fuck Starlink and their absurd amount of satellites. Why are things that are bad on paper still out into practice and then get people to talk about it as if its the next best thing after sliced bread? 5 Geo orbit satellites do the same and more than an entire fleet of star link satellites that would ruin Astronomy forever, not to mention the pollution, high cost, and now having these stupid dots fly visibly through the sky at night. These satellites will fall out of the sky within a decade due to their low orbit so continously require more launches to resupply them, adding pollution over pollution. None of this is even mentioning the risk for a full scale Kessler syndrome with this trash.

Fully agree, Starlink (and others like it) should be forbidden

[-] Maggoty@lemmy.world 8 points 4 days ago

Don't worry next we're going to solve the non-existent problem of metal scarcity by dragging the ocean floor. Even though it will obliterate entire ecosystems built around the nodules we're going to mine. All so a billionaire can become a multi billionaire.

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[-] healthetank@lemmy.ca 45 points 5 days ago

I mean, moving beyond the loan part, (not a grant, meaning that we will get the money back), is this not what the Canadian population wants? The govt investing money to provide alternative options to the big 3 for internet?

Call me jaded, but I imagine they'll get bought up in 5-10 by Robellus, but it's a step in the right direction.

Beyond that, do we really want our critical infrastructure tied to a company with such a shoddy and unpredictable "face man"?

[-] Routhinator@startrek.website 19 points 5 days ago

This is exactly what we want. Fuck the conservatives and Musk.

[-] Kichae@lemmy.ca 15 points 5 days ago

I want a public fibre network, not for-profit space junk.

[-] Revan343@lemmy.ca 12 points 4 days ago

Well you're not going to get a fibre network, public or private, in the far north. Not happening.

Massive towers and directional dishes is probably a better approach than LEO satellites though

[-] Auli@lemmy.ca 1 points 3 days ago

Yes. As long as their Canadian. We are just a siphon for Americans to get cash from.

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[-] smallpatatas@lemm.ee 14 points 4 days ago

Did no one in the replies happen to notice that this is a loan

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[-] Sunshine@lemmy.ca 36 points 5 days ago

Of course the conservatives want that unreliable tempered man in charge of our communications where new customers got unexpectedly charged a $100 fee.

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[-] Grant_M@lemmy.ca 29 points 5 days ago

PP wants to hand Canada over to Musk and the deranged US far right.

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[-] TerkErJerbs@lemm.ee 14 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago)

Unfortunately this is where Musk figured out how to corner the market ahead of time. It was the same thing when cellular tech came into the mainstream. Lots of less developed countries with poor or no hardwired telcom infra found that skipping ahead to next-gen tech (cell towers) was super cheap and quick to build, so lots of corners of the earth found themselves connected in the 90's that had never been prior to that decade.

Starlink and low-orbit sats for internet coverage are a similar leap ahead in cost and speed to deploy. Elon and his goons saw it coming long before anyone else did, and the fact they also have Space X was a pretty key part of their speed to deploy.

I'm no Elon stan, I hate the fucking guy. But it is what it is. He got there first and people in northern canada can already access Starlink for under 200/mo. I am no math guy but I suspect that even if the fed gov paid every cent of everyone's subscription to Starlink it wouldn't amount to 2 billion dollars. ๐Ÿคท

EDIT just did some napkin math. With the help of wiki found that the population of northern canada is less than 120k people. So cost of taxpayers footing the bill for everyone up there to be on Starlink would be 24 million/yr. Or... for that same 2 billion, 83 years of Starlink subscriptions for each and every person up there. That would be if each single person had their own dish.

[-] Thrillhouse@lemmy.world 22 points 5 days ago

Telesat is a Canadian company. The benefit extends beyond just the satellite internet service. We get a domestic provider of this service so we donโ€™t have to rely on Elon and his ketamine delusions and ties to Russia. This will also create Canadian jobs and boost our economy.

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[-] lemmyng@lemmy.ca 32 points 5 days ago

Except that Starlink pricing and throughput is not linear. They're starting to add congestion charges in popular areas, they have no satellites at higher latitudes, and their devices suffer at low temperatures. If you think that Starlink will be able to deliver what Elmo claims, then I have a trip to the Titanic to sell to you.

[-] smallpatatas@lemm.ee 3 points 3 days ago

Not to mention that their napkin math is wrong by a factor of 12

[-] TerkErJerbs@lemm.ee 2 points 2 days ago

Yeah I got the memo. Disclaimer above that I am not a math guy and shouldn't have ever attempted it. ๐Ÿคท

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this post was submitted on 22 Sep 2024
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